Another reason to go vegan

[nick_m100]

http://www.chooseveg.com/animal-cruelty.asp?gclid=CLzQjfaLuJACFQUllgod_m2XLQ

I am not vegan but I am pretty close in that I hardly ever eat meat and on the rare occasions I do it's because that particular item was easiest to get to. If the thing is all meat then I won't eat it at all it has to be covered by non-meat things. But seriously watch this and don't stop until the end no matter how sickening you find it.

 

[giddieon]

Not all farms are like this it is sad though but we need food on a mass scale and meat is a large part of it...

I am Canadian and we are one of he larges exporters of cattle, Pork and other things like sheep and lamb....

sorry to say but this is not a common practice of farmers and this video is showing the worst of the worst...

Lets not paint all farmers with the same brush....

 

[nick_m100]

Well quite frankly i'm not saying that meat is bad and you should never eat it ever just that they need to fix these things and if there are farms that are that bad then they need to be fixed so videos like this can't surface.

 

[giddieon]

Well quite frankly i'm not saying that meat is bad and you should never eat it ever just that they need to fix these things and if there are farms that are that bad then they need to be fixed so videos like this can't surface.

Well said!!!

 

[sparkchaser]

The meat I buy comes from a local organic farm. Best tasting meat I've ever had. I don't feel bad eating them.

 

[Stewart]

Can't watch it from work but, based on the domain name, I would suggest that the source is hardly unbiased and that, if the footage is bad, they're using the worst they could find.

But I love meat. Yum!

 

[sparkchaser]

Mmmmmm...that meaty goodness that is meat.

 

[G4G]

I'm hungry now.

 

[Sybarite]

Homo sapiens is an omnivore, so eating meat and fish and diary products is entirely natural.

If you're concerned about cruelty to non-human animals in food production, then there's a really quite simple solution – buy from reputable suppliers. Best of all, buy from a farmer who farms in a reputable manner. Ask about how the animals are treated, fed, slaughtered etc.

Not only does this deal with concerns about welfare, but almost certainly ensures that you're going to get far, far better meat.

If this is difficult, then see what organic and/or welfare-minded meat products your local supermarket/s stock. If they haven't got what you want, ask them to get it.

If you find that buying a better quality of meat is more expensive, then cut back on meat generally. Instead of eating meat every day, do so two or three times a week and use fish or non-meat dishes for the rest of the week. It's a healthier diet anyway.

I don't know about the US, but in the UK, a lot of people treat food essentially as fuel – something to put into your body to keep you going, but something that holds little pleasure in itself and should take as little time as possible to prepare and cost as little as possible. Result – local shopping streets have pretty much been killed and replaced by a few chains of vast supermarkets.

Go to the Continent and you find a completely different approach – food has a real value in society and in family life. It's so easy to find superb food in places like Barcelona or Paris; it's getting better in London, but we're light years behind and the majority still don't give a toss what they actually stuff into their mouths.

We have children in the UK who, according to surveys, haven't got a clue that meat even comes from animals. I've heard children who can't recognise rhubarb or celery (both domestic crops). We're still in a long-term battle to ensure that school meals are not salt and sugar and additive-laden junk (thanks to the Thatcher government, that knew the cost of everything and the value of absolutely nothing). I personally know of a child who, at almost eight years old, is only just learning to use a knife and fork because her grandparents are insisting. Her mother has simply fed her fast food that can be eaten with her fingers – pizzas, burgers, chips, sandwiches etc. This is not a unique situation, but one that has been reported in primary schools across the country.

Teach people to enjoy food and you'll teach them to value food. That will mean better food – and can be a major force behind the improvement of conditions for animals.

Phew! Rant over.

 

[eyez0nme]

Meat is bad.

It causes cancer, diabetes, stroke, cardiovascular disease, and host of other illness.

 

[sparkchaser]

Meat is bad.

It causes cancer, diabetes, stroke, cardiovascular disease, and host of other illness.

You made the claim, now prove it. Using clinical studies. Don't point me to PETA or SPCA or Greenpeace sites. I want reputable medical journals.


Anything in excess has the potential of being bad for you. Including water.

 

[Jez]

You made the claim, now prove it. Using clinical studies. Don't point me to PETA or SPCA or Greenpeace sites. I want reputable medical journals.


Anything in excess has the potential of being bad for you. Including water.

Especially when the rest of a person's diet isn't too great

 

[chuephödli]

These days, religious fights are no longer about our metaphysical well-being anymore - they are about down-to-earth issues like food.

I guess that is progress of sorts.

Having said that, I find the whole industrial production of meat (battery chickens etc) really disgusting. I cannot quite see why that should put me off meat, though - there are enough outlets that sell meat from animals which were treated completely differently.

 

[eyez0nme]

You made the claim, now prove it. Using clinical studies. Don't point me to PETA or SPCA or Greenpeace sites. I want reputable medical journals.


Anything in excess has the potential of being bad for you. Including water.

I don't need to prove it.

You will get one of those disease in the near future.

Look up "carcinogen" on wikipedia.org

 

[eyez0nme]

Straight from wikipedia: heterocyclic amines

Some heterocyclic amines (HCAs) found in cooked meat are known carcinogens. Research has shown that cooking certain meats at high temperatures creates chemicals that are not present in uncooked meats. For example, heterocyclic amines are the carcinogenic chemicals formed from the cooking of muscle meats such as beef, pork, fowl, and fish. HCAs form when amino acids and creatine (a chemical found in muscles) react at high cooking temperatures. Researchers have identified 17 different HCAs resulting from the cooking of muscle meats that may pose human cancer risk.[1] NCI's Division of Cancer Epidemiology and Genetics found a link between individuals with stomach cancer and the consumption of cooked meat, and other studies for colorectal, pancreatic, and breast cancer is associated with high intakes of well-done, fried, or barbecued meats. Other sources of protein (milk, eggs, tofu, and organ meats such as liver) have very little or no HCA content naturally or when cooked.

So eat your meat bloody rare.

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/heterocyclic-amines

 

[eyez0nme]

http://www.food.gov.uk/safereating/chemsafe/acrylamide_branch/

Cooking food at high temperatures, for example broiling or barbecuing meats, can lead to the formation of minute quantities of many potent carcinogens that are comparable to those found in cigarette smoke (i.e., benzopyrene).[1] Charring of food resembles coking and tobacco pyrolysis, and produces similar carcinogens. There are several carcinogenic pyrolysis products, such as polynuclear aromatic hydrocarbons, which are converted by human enzymes into epoxides, which attach permanently to DNA. Pre-cooking meats in a microwave oven for 2-3 minutes before broiling shortens the time on the hot pan, which can help minimize the formation of these carcinogens.

Reports from the Food Standards Agency have found that the known animal carcinogen Acrylamide. is generated in fried or overheated carbohydrate foods (such as french fries and potato chips).

So this is why you don't eat junk food.

 

[sparkchaser]

I don't need to prove it.

You will get one of those disease in the near future.

Look up "carcinogen" on wikipedia.org

No, I'll take my definition from the Britannica Concise Encyclopedia.

Agent that can cause cancer. Exposure to one or more carcinogens, including certain chemicals, radiation, and certain viruses, can initiate cancer under conditions not completely understood. Some people have a genetic tendency to develop cancer when exposed to a specific carcinogen or combination of carcinogens. Repeated local injury or irritation to a part of the body can be carcinogenic. Identifying and eliminating carcinogens in time can reduce the incidence of cancer.

How do you know that if I get cancer it wasn't occupational or all that air pollution I breath when I'm in town? How do you know those clogged arteries aren't from peanut butter? Nobody does. Not even the doctor. Some people, due to genetics and lifestyle, are more likely to get sick than others.

Are you going to stop eating vegetables too? According to the American Council on Science and Health (a reputable source, unlike Wikipedia) most foods, vegetables included, contain carcinogens.

Acetaldehyde (apples, bread, coffee, tomatoes)—mutagen and potent rodent carcinogen

Acrylamide (bread, rolls)—rodent and human neurotoxin; rodent carcinogen

Aflatoxin (nuts)—mutagen and potent rodent carcinogen; also a human carcinogen

Allyl isothiocyanate (arugula, broccoli, mustard)—mutagen and rodent carcinogen

Aniline (carrots)—rodent carcinogen

Benzaldehyde (apples, coffee, tomatoes)—rodent carcinogen

Benzene (butter, coffee, roast beef)—rodent carcinogen

Benzo(a)pyrene (bread, coffee, pumpkin pie, rolls, tea)—mutagen and rodent carcinogen

Benzofuran (coffee)—rodent carcinogen

Benzyl acetate (jasmine tea)—rodent carcinogen

Caffeic acid (apples, carrots, celery, cherry tomatoes, cof-fee, grapes, lettuce, mangos, pears, potatoes)—rodent carcinogen

Catechol (coffee)—rodent carcinogen

Coumarin (cinnamon in pies)—rodent carcinogen

1,2,5,6-dibenz(a)anthracene (coffee)—rodent carcinogen

Estragole (apples, basil)—rodent carcinogen

Ethyl alcohol (bread, red wine, rolls)—rodent and human carcinogen

Ethyl acrylate (pineapple)—rodent carcinogen

Ethyl benzene (coffee)—rodent carcinogen

Ethyl carbamate (bread, rolls, red wine)—mutagen and rodent carcinogen

Furan and furan derivatives (bread, onions, celery, mushrooms, sweet potatoes, rolls, cranberry sauce, coffee)—many are mutagens

Furfural (bread, coffee, nuts, rolls, sweet potatoes)—furan derivative and rodent carcinogen

Heterocyclic amines (roast beef, turkey)—mutagens and rodent carcinogens

Hydrazines (mushrooms)—mutagens and rodent carcinogens

Hydrogen peroxide (coffee, tomatoes)—mutagen and rodent carcinogen

Hydroquinone (coffee)—rodent carcinogen

d-limonene (black pepper, mangos)—rodent carcinogen

4-methylcatechol (coffee)—rodent carcinogen

Methyl eugenol (basil, cinnamon and nutmeg in apple and pumpkin pies)—rodent carcinogen

Psoralens (celery, parsley)—mutagens; rodent and human carcinogens

Quercetin glycosides (apples, onions, tea, tomatoes)—mutagens and rodent carcinogens

Safrole (nutmeg in apple and pumpkin pies, black pepper)—rodent carcinogen

I'd be more worried about all those chemicals floating around in the air, mingling in the water, and sitting in the dirt than food. Man has been eating meat and vegetables and fungus for millions of years and has managed to survive (except for the ones that ate the poison mushrooms). It's our lifestyle more than our diet that's making us sick.

Don't forget to eat your veggies!

 

[Stewart]

Look up "carcinogen" on wikipedia.org

First of all, Wikipedia isn't the be all and end all of information. It's put together by anonymous users and you can't take its information as being reputable since you don't know who put it there. A scientific journal with an unbiased focus is more reputable, so link to one of them.

Secondly, there's carcinogens in burnt toast, so what have they got to do with eating meat?

Incidentally, I had zebra meat, crocodile meat, rabbit, pheasant, and venison last week. Yum!

 

[Sybarite]

Well said, Sparkchaser.

It's extraordinary idea that something that we have evolved in order to eat is apparently so bad for us. What a strange process this evolution is, eh?

Olive oil is good for you but can, in certain situations be carcinogenic. To explain: you should never cook with virgin or extra virgin olive oil* – because it's only had one pressing, there are tiny bits of the actual olive still in the oil. These, on heating, can become carcinogenic. So you cook with ordinary olive oil (which has been pressed more often) and keep the virgin stuff for dressings etc.

Now will eyez0nme be arriving to tell us simply that we shouldn't eat olive oil at all, ever?

Following on from your comments, Sparkchaser, one could point out that the French consume more dairy produce than any other nation on Earth. So by rights, you'd expect greater levels of heart disease in France than anywhere else. Except that this doesn't happen. Scientists started to explore why and discovered that red wine, which is drunk freely in that country, particularly with a meal, actually reduces the effects of the cholesterol in the dairy produce. Of course, too much wine causes it's own problems. But that's why you will now often see the suggestion that a glass or two of red wine per days is actually good for you.

And spot on to point out the importance of eating vegetables – five portions of fruit and/or veg a day is our minimum suggested intake by medical bods in the UK. Interestingly, in France, it's seven for women and eight for men, but I suspect that those who set out these targets think that that would be considered unrealistic in a culture that, as I mentioned earlier in this thread, doesn't generally like food much anyway.

Incidentally, I did note that eyez0nme does seem to confuse "junk food" with food generally, including, given the context of his/her other comments, meat in general.

I reiterate: reducing meat (red meat in particular) is good for a diet, but it also means that you can then spend more on ensuring that you buy good meat – ie meat that has been farmed ethically. You'll notice the difference in the quality of the meat that you eat too.

Stewart – sounds great! Have you tried ostrich? Very lean and tasty – a bit like a gamey beef, if that makes sense. I've just been to my local farmers' market and picked up woodcock for Christmas Eve and venison for Christmas Day; all reared in an ethical way. I know it will be good.

Finally (at present ), it's worth noting the difficulties that women in particular face with an unnatural vegan diet – increased risk of osteoporosis, for instance, plus iron deficiences at certain times of the month.








* It's also ludicrously expensive to cook with a flavours the food too much.

 

[Stewart]

Stewart – sounds great! Have you tried ostrich?

Yep. Kangaroo, springbok, yak, and wild boar, too. Bison, kudu, and wildebeest are on the horizon. Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be any llama or alpaca available in Europe.