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Books Instead of Probation

abecedarian said:
I just wanted to share this article in today's Wichita Eagle. I've heard of other judges doing something like this, but this is the first time I know of it being done here. I hope it helps. Read the article and tell me what you think.

http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/news/columnists/mark_mccormick/12698183.htm

I don't always agree with Mark McCormick, but I appreciate him writing about this.
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Our nation does have one of the highest incarceration rates in the world. The only problem I see with this is that a lot of criminals aren't highly educated and a lot of them have reading problems. Will they have books read to them or something? I'm all for it, it would do wonders to try and plant seeds of understanding and thinking within them. It certainly couldn't hurt.
 
I've read about similar programs in various parts of the country. I think it was in The Book Group Book by Ellen Slezak, that I read about a judge starting a book club for some of the offenders she met. Also, in A Voice of Her Own by Marlene Schiwy, she tells of coordinating writing programs for inner city women in the Springfield Mass area. Jimmy Baca's A Place to Stand chronicles the authors journey from illiterate drug dealer to poet and writing professor. So, maybe this program has merit. Just tossing people in prison obviously is not the answer for everyone.
 
Of course the program isn't for everyone. The article states that the judge is doing it for young adult probationers. These kids are just starting down the road to prison and this seems to be a way to help them find a different path.
 
Apparently the book club isn't instead of probation, but part of probation, which I think is a very constructive idea. May not work for everyone, but why not try it? It can't hurt.
 
I think it is a great idea. Why not encourage people to do something constructive with their time rather than simply saying "get a job, stay out of trouble"? It seems like this judge realizes that our prison system is too overtaxed to really rehabilitate prisoners. Instead of just complaining about it, she is taking it into her own hands to become a more personal part of their rehabilitation.
 
mehastings said:
I think it is a great idea. Why not encourage people to do something constructive with their time rather than simply saying "get a job, stay out of trouble"? It seems like this judge realizes that our prison system is too overtaxed to really rehabilitate prisoners. Instead of just complaining about it, she is taking it into her own hands to become a more personal part of their rehabilitation.
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That makes too much sense. We all know that inmates find the best jobs. and a good sense of self-worth through helping to punch numbers into metal sheets to create license plates. Books, schmooks-do what we are doing now, crminals aren't learning how to become better or more serious criminals. They are "doing their time" and learning that crime does not pay. :rolleyes: ;) :p
 
SFG75 said:
That makes too much sense. We all know that inmates find the best jobs. and a good sense of self-worth through helping to punch numbers into metal sheets to create license plates.
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Around here they don't make license plates. They repaint cop cars. While I can see that they are learning a trade, without the right support they can also be learning how to repaint cars they steal.
 
I've had enough of hearing about criminals getting the soft touch, to be honest. If someone's done something wrong in a society, then that person shouldn't be a part of it, or have access to the things that access brings.
 
So you suggest locking every criminal up, CDA? Including the minor ones who are just in for petty theft, which are probably the ones we're talking about here. Who's gonna pay the bill for housing and feeding them? You? Me? Or should we just reinstate capital punishment for petty theft? Makes things much easier, or perhaps we should just start deporting our undesirables to the colonies in North America... oh wait... uhm wrong century...
 
Jemima Aslana said:
So you suggest locking every criminal up, CDA? Including the minor ones who are just in for petty theft, which are probably the ones we're talking about here. Who's gonna pay the bill for housing and feeding them? You? Me? Or should we just reinstate capital punishment for petty theft? Makes things much easier, or perhaps we should just start deporting our undesirables to the colonies in North America... oh wait... uhm wrong century...
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If I had my way I'd shoot them :) But anyway - if someone commits a crime they should be punished accordingly. not given things like books. i guess that's what i'm trying to say.
 
Programs like this is for offenders who, in the judge's estimation, might benefit from a different "treatment" than simply throwing them into prison. Sometimes a life can be changed for the better by methods like this. Lord knows the current system has been a dismal failure in the rehabilitation depaartment. A lot of these people wind up in trouble because of abuse, neglect, and poor education( some are learning disabled-which is another can of worms I know). So, perhaps a programn like this might be a way to keep offenders from becoming repeat offenders, or life-ers.
I understand the rancor towards criminals. Violent offenders should be executed, or at least inccarcerated for life, with no parole. But these sort of programs are aimed at the younger, less violent offenders, trying to keep them from graduating to harsher crimes and sentences.
 
Crimes such as theft, vandalism, that sort of thing. I can easily forgive and forget - and take that from someone who's had several things stolen once in a while. Take it also from someone who has shoplifted more than was smart. I never got caught - I *was* smart :p

Ahem yeah, it has long since been proven that prison sentences does not make people better people, and more likely to behave. The sentences mainly work to keep people off the streets who are a danger to others and to frighten others out of committing crimes in the first place. Once you've been to prison you have it hanging over your head for a long time, and when you get out it won't be a clean slate and starting over for you, even if you *did* learn your lesson. There will be certain places where you can't get jobs, if a competitor for a job ties with you, the old sentence will make sure you don't get said job.

So unless we intend to lock people up for life or actually start executing people for painting graffiti on a wall here or there we need other solutions.

Getting in there with the rough guys won't teach anyone to behave.

Better solution, in my opinion would be to find out WHY these people commit crimes, and then strike at the root of the problem(s), not just treat the symptoms. If anyone can feel resentment towards some kids being given books to avoid them going from petty theft and vandalism to drug-dealing and murder I see a problem with priorities, to be honest, not to mention a horrible disregard for human lives. No one's ever gonna incur the death penalty for petty theft, but if you'd rather turn the criminal into a murderer thereby wasting both the murder-victim's and the could-have-been-helped-criminal's lives, then by all means...

I definitely won't go all sour-faced over someone who can be helped by it being given a book, if I did I should through principle also go sour-faced over Katrina's victims being given books to keep them occupied so they won't turn to ... what have you.... vandalism for instance. We can never have too many books going around out there - and I really can't see it as a problem that some people get them for free. That's just being petty.
 
Jemima Aslana said:
If anyone can feel resentment towards some kids being given books to avoid them going from petty theft and vandalism to drug-dealing and murder I see a problem with priorities, to be honest, not to mention a horrible disregard for human lives.
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I agree with you. I also think the point to keep in mind here is that these men are not being offered "the soft touch". These guys are reading a book as part of their probation. Rebecca Pilshaw is called "A judge who is known for her particularly tough sentences". I don't think this is any different than giving people community service for a first time minor crime. Jail is not always the answer. In many places it is simply a free meal and a networking oportunity for people looking to commit future crimes.
 
cajunmama said:
Of course the program isn't for everyone. The article states that the judge is doing it for young adult probationers. These kids are just starting down the road to prison and this seems to be a way to help them find a different path.
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i agree

but at the same time, the person might not take it seriously or bother to find any messege/meaning
 
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