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Marketing books
- Thread starter Xeon
- Start date
Motokid
New Member
help?
There is so much information it's mind blowing. Weeding through it all and finding specific data you can use is very difficult. I would suggest typing "internet marketing" into google or yahoo and start reading.
Do you have a web site? Can it be found by people like me who have no idea who you are, or what the title of your book is?
How much money would you like to spend on marketing? Can you afford to place adds in magazines and newspapers? Most places suggest for this to work you must be consistantly placing the add for a very long time. A one time posting ad will not work.
Most places will tell you word of mouth is the best marketing. Do you have an incentive for people who currently own your book, to tell others about it?
Write press releases and send them to local newspapers and magazines. Try to get them to write up a review about your book.
They will also tell you to get involved in forums that are specific to your type of book.
Read "Guerrilla Marketing" by Jay Conrad Levinson.
And use your search engines.
Hope some of this helps.
There is so much information it's mind blowing. Weeding through it all and finding specific data you can use is very difficult. I would suggest typing "internet marketing" into google or yahoo and start reading.
Do you have a web site? Can it be found by people like me who have no idea who you are, or what the title of your book is?
How much money would you like to spend on marketing? Can you afford to place adds in magazines and newspapers? Most places suggest for this to work you must be consistantly placing the add for a very long time. A one time posting ad will not work.
Most places will tell you word of mouth is the best marketing. Do you have an incentive for people who currently own your book, to tell others about it?
Write press releases and send them to local newspapers and magazines. Try to get them to write up a review about your book.
They will also tell you to get involved in forums that are specific to your type of book.
Read "Guerrilla Marketing" by Jay Conrad Levinson.
And use your search engines.
Hope some of this helps.
Motokid
New Member
web site and book
there's a web site: www.selfpromotion.com that's pretty good
and a book and web site called Sales Dogs that's part of the Rich Dad/Poor Dad series that has some interesting stuff, with links to other pages
www.salesdogs.com
they are not specific to marketing and selling books, but marketing and selling in general
there's a web site: www.selfpromotion.com that's pretty good
and a book and web site called Sales Dogs that's part of the Rich Dad/Poor Dad series that has some interesting stuff, with links to other pages
www.salesdogs.com
they are not specific to marketing and selling books, but marketing and selling in general
Stewart
Active Member
Xeon said:
You'll find the biggest tip is not to self publish at all - if your work is any good then a proper publisher (and not some vanity setup) will find you as you long as you review output of the publishers you send to, keep an eye on editors moving between publishing houses, and monitoring an editor's tastes.
Motokid
New Member
????
The only reason I got "published" is because I self-published first.
Publishers are very wierd. They all state they are looking for something "new and unique", but then tell you to check the list of books they've previously published to see if your work falls in line with what they've been doing in the past.
Does that make any sense at all?
Many people are successful in many different ways. Don't listen to one person too closely. Always keep an open mind and try as many differnt avenues as you can afford to try.
The key is to not give up if you believe what you have is good.
The only reason I got "published" is because I self-published first.
Publishers are very wierd. They all state they are looking for something "new and unique", but then tell you to check the list of books they've previously published to see if your work falls in line with what they've been doing in the past.
Does that make any sense at all?
Many people are successful in many different ways. Don't listen to one person too closely. Always keep an open mind and try as many differnt avenues as you can afford to try.
The key is to not give up if you believe what you have is good.
Motokid
New Member
hardest part
The most difficult thing about getting published is the lengthy string of rejections it takes to find the right publisher.
How many times can the average person be rejected before they give up?
How long before the author starts questioning if their work is good enough?
You question how so many other books that are pure crap got published yet your work keeps getting turned down.
Sometimes self-publishing is the answer. The hardest part of self-publishing is exactly the question that started this thread. How then, do you get people to know your book exists?
The most difficult thing about getting published is the lengthy string of rejections it takes to find the right publisher.
How many times can the average person be rejected before they give up?
How long before the author starts questioning if their work is good enough?
You question how so many other books that are pure crap got published yet your work keeps getting turned down.
Sometimes self-publishing is the answer. The hardest part of self-publishing is exactly the question that started this thread. How then, do you get people to know your book exists?
Stewart
Active Member
Motokid said:
Here's a few suggestions:
- Advertise on book forums/sites;
- Purchase some GoogleAds or something similar in context;
- Get a personal website and optimise it for search engines;*
- Become active in book groups;
- Talk to local book shops and see if they are willing to sell it;
- Try and get it reviewed by a local newspaper;
* I think this really deserves a thread of its own about what an author's webste should and should not be. I've already started a thread on authors' websites and about how bad the majority were; for either content or layout.
Stewart
Active Member
I suppose book groups in your case are a bad idea due to your book being for young ones. Maybe, for childrens' books, you could visit local schools and read the book to them. Nothing encourages sales than the current climate of spoilt kids wanting everything...and getting it.
Motokid
New Member
uh huh
I don't know that Xeon's book is for children. I was offering my 2 cents for Xeon.
If your giving me advice, thanks. I've been doing those things. I also have a publisher who is advertising, and marketing. But it does not hurt my cause if I help it along too, right?
I have found that donating books to charities, and having charity auctions raises awareness of what your trying to promote. Try an e-bay auction of an autographed copy for a charity of your choice.
The interesting thing about marketing a children's book is this:
Who do you market to? The kids or the parents?
The parents are the final decision makers. The ones who plunk down the cash. The kids are the ones who beg and plead and cry until they get what they want. Were's the best place to focus your marketing efforts?
I'll except any ideas you guys have...so will Xeon I'm sure.
I don't know that Xeon's book is for children. I was offering my 2 cents for Xeon.
If your giving me advice, thanks. I've been doing those things. I also have a publisher who is advertising, and marketing. But it does not hurt my cause if I help it along too, right?
I have found that donating books to charities, and having charity auctions raises awareness of what your trying to promote. Try an e-bay auction of an autographed copy for a charity of your choice.
The interesting thing about marketing a children's book is this:
Who do you market to? The kids or the parents?
The parents are the final decision makers. The ones who plunk down the cash. The kids are the ones who beg and plead and cry until they get what they want. Were's the best place to focus your marketing efforts?
I'll except any ideas you guys have...so will Xeon I'm sure.
-
Thanks a lot, MotoKid and Stewart! Those replies were invaluable!
In the past, I sold gift mugs and so purchased a pay-per-click(PPC) advertising package on a gift ideas forum. The majority of this ad package is still un-used, meaning that when my book is released, I could use the leftover PPC to get some exposure. This isn't niche, but it's better than nothing.
In my country, getting an ISBN is free, so at least I don't have to worry about that.
Also, Stewart...how did you know my book is for kids? It's not, really!
It's more for young folks between the ages of 12 - 24.
From Stewart:
Here are some information on my book.
Genre
The genre should be classified as funny fantasy. The book is based on the Norse legends. In my book, the legends are written in such a way that they're told by a certain goddess in these legends, in a personal and funny style. Informative but somewhat chic-lit style with indirect profanity here and there.
Length
The book is a standard paperback book with around 150+ pages. The words are those small fonts you see in adult paperbacks.
Setting
The timing is set in the days long long ago. The places mainly revolved around the nine worlds of the Norse cosmos. The legends in the book are told in a relaxed and complacent atmosphere.
Gender of protagonist
Since the legends are narrrated by a goddess, the main protagonist is considered a female.
Illustrated?
No, although in the first few pages of the book, there are several black-and-white rough maps of the realms told in the legends.
Theme
The theme is about the many exciting events and details that happened in the Norse legends.
Standalone or series
Series. This book will be the first of many which is to come in future.
That's about my book.
Because my book is about the Norse myths, I could purchase some cheap links on the top Norse resource sites to get traffic. Or I could get a freelance SEO expert to get high search engine rankings for my site. I personally think that paying the sites so that they link to you is a better option. Which one would be better, in your view?
It would be great if you folks can review this and give me some advice, though! Your help is deeply appreciated!
Have a nice day and thanks!
Xeon.
Thanks a lot, MotoKid and Stewart! Those replies were invaluable!
Well, I could spend at the most a hundred dollars or so. I know that's pretty pathetic, but the costs for the web hosting and such have already sucked my budget dry.
In the past, I sold gift mugs and so purchased a pay-per-click(PPC) advertising package on a gift ideas forum. The majority of this ad package is still un-used, meaning that when my book is released, I could use the leftover PPC to get some exposure. This isn't niche, but it's better than nothing.
In my country, getting an ISBN is free, so at least I don't have to worry about that.
Also, Stewart...how did you know my book is for kids? It's not, really!
It's more for young folks between the ages of 12 - 24.
From Stewart:
Here are some information on my book.
Genre
The genre should be classified as funny fantasy. The book is based on the Norse legends. In my book, the legends are written in such a way that they're told by a certain goddess in these legends, in a personal and funny style. Informative but somewhat chic-lit style with indirect profanity here and there.
Length
The book is a standard paperback book with around 150+ pages. The words are those small fonts you see in adult paperbacks.
Setting
The timing is set in the days long long ago. The places mainly revolved around the nine worlds of the Norse cosmos. The legends in the book are told in a relaxed and complacent atmosphere.
Gender of protagonist
Since the legends are narrrated by a goddess, the main protagonist is considered a female.
Illustrated?
No, although in the first few pages of the book, there are several black-and-white rough maps of the realms told in the legends.
Theme
The theme is about the many exciting events and details that happened in the Norse legends.
Standalone or series
Series. This book will be the first of many which is to come in future.
That's about my book.
Because my book is about the Norse myths, I could purchase some cheap links on the top Norse resource sites to get traffic. Or I could get a freelance SEO expert to get high search engine rankings for my site. I personally think that paying the sites so that they link to you is a better option. Which one would be better, in your view?
It would be great if you folks can review this and give me some advice, though! Your help is deeply appreciated!
Have a nice day and thanks!
Xeon.
Stewart
Active Member
Xeon said:
Keywords to target may include Norse, myths, Vikings, book, and fantasy. Words like Yggdrasil are notworth it.
Also, Stewart...how did you know my book is for kids? It's not, really!
I didn't. The kids' book comments were revolving around Motokid's kids' book.
It would be nice to see your site. SEO is a great practice - I'm currently building the home page for my site with the intention of ranking in the first five results of Google for my intended keywords. The basic tips are:
- Get a paid for domain name - subdomains of free sites are not that good;
- Have content, the more content you can have to accompany the main focus of the site - maybe a small Norse myth library - then the happier search engines will be to crawl your site and get a better taste for it;
- Put your keywords into the TITLE tag (i.e. My Book - A Norse Tale by Xeon)
- Put the keywords into the H1 tags. Aim to have 4%-7% of the text on your site to include the necessary keywords you are targetting.
- Use a metatag to allow robots to index the whole site;
- Use alt tags for your images, try using keywords when necessary;
- Ensure links are well named - no 'Click here' links;
- Add a few external links;
- And, the hardest part, get links. Try to find other authors in a similar boat with websites and arrange link exchanges in order to boost your search engine rankings as Google awards high places mostly based on links in to your site from external sites.
- Avoid all free things that you can add to your site i.e. Bravenet counters, guestbooks, etc.
-
Wow, thanks for the fast response, Stewart! I will look into them.
On the other hand, there's also offline marketing and distribution.
I was thinking, I could actually get my first big break if a few of the bookstores accept and sell my books on their shelves.
My plan for this offline book distribution is that I get in contact with the store owners and get them to purchase a small quantity of my books via my publisher, CafePress Publishing.( http://www.cafepress.com/cp/info/help/learn_book.aspx )
My current view is that these bookstore owners will purchase it if they find my book interesting. Furthermore, since CafePress offers a bulk-purchase discount and a 30 day money-back guarantee plan, plus if I add in my own discount, they would order my book and put it on their shelves?
I hope someone can give me advice on this. I feel that offline marketing(in particular, getting your books on small local bookstores) will yield more extreme results than online marketing.
Thanks!
Xeon.
Wow, thanks for the fast response, Stewart! I will look into them.
On the other hand, there's also offline marketing and distribution.
I was thinking, I could actually get my first big break if a few of the bookstores accept and sell my books on their shelves.
My plan for this offline book distribution is that I get in contact with the store owners and get them to purchase a small quantity of my books via my publisher, CafePress Publishing.( http://www.cafepress.com/cp/info/help/learn_book.aspx )
My current view is that these bookstore owners will purchase it if they find my book interesting. Furthermore, since CafePress offers a bulk-purchase discount and a 30 day money-back guarantee plan, plus if I add in my own discount, they would order my book and put it on their shelves?
I hope someone can give me advice on this. I feel that offline marketing(in particular, getting your books on small local bookstores) will yield more extreme results than online marketing.
Thanks!
Xeon.
Most independent book stores (at least in America, but I don't know where you are) will allow consignment of books directly from the author. With a consignment agreement, you provide the books at a 40% discount off list. When the book sells, they pay you 10% back, and keep 30% for themselves. You can find a list of Independent book stores on the web for your local region, and you might try to entice General Independents distributors into picking it up. The trick with self-publishing is that usually the books are "non-returnable". Consignment overcomes this problem, because if they don't sell, they simply return them to you. But again, it can cost money, because they won't keep it on the shelf indefinitely and you have to pay for the books initially. And it has to be coupled with effective promotion. Since this is a YA fantasy title (Young Adult), you should look for author groups that allow self-pubbed members. You'll meet a lot of people in groups like this (and the membership dues will fit nicely in your budget).
Your next goal is to get reviews. Do a websearch for fantasy review websites and see which do YA books. If you provide an ARC, PDF or HTML copy, they'll usually review it for you, even if it's self-pubbed. The more reviews the merrier, because that expands both your target reader base as well as provide additional promo to get the indie book stores to stock it.
Hope that helps, and feel free to contact me off post if you need more ideas!
Cathy
Your next goal is to get reviews. Do a websearch for fantasy review websites and see which do YA books. If you provide an ARC, PDF or HTML copy, they'll usually review it for you, even if it's self-pubbed. The more reviews the merrier, because that expands both your target reader base as well as provide additional promo to get the indie book stores to stock it.
Hope that helps, and feel free to contact me off post if you need more ideas!
Cathy
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Hi Cathy! Nice to hear from you again!
However, I'm trying to target the book at the Western market(America, Britain and Canada especially) because the stories/nature of the book appeals to them more.
Also, what are General Independents Distributors?
Have a nice sweet day,
Xeon.
Hi Cathy! Nice to hear from you again!
Giving heavy discounts is not a problem, really. I could give discounts of up to beyond 65%.
I will try to find the lists of Independent book stores, thanks!
However, I'm trying to target the book at the Western market(America, Britain and Canada especially) because the stories/nature of the book appeals to them more.
Also, what are General Independents Distributors?
Pay for the books initially? You mean, I have to buy some copies of my book to keep in my house before they will buy it? Kind of makes no sense to me, but I think I misunderstood you. More details would be helpful!
But will author groups help to market your books etc.? Because since we're selling our own books, maybe taking part in reader groups would be more suitable?
Thanks Cathy! Is this dangerous and risky, in your opinion? What if these reviewers take everything in my book and claim it as their own, and submit it to some publishing house? In the end, I might be betrayed and left with nothing.
Thanks a lot, Cathy! I really appreciate your help in this area. I will seek to learn more from you.
Have a nice sweet day,
Xeon.
Motokid
New Member
protection
Check out what Trafford On-Demand publishing has to offer.
www.trafford.com
They set you up with an ISBN number, Library Of Congress number, copyright protection, a web page, .....but you still own all the rights and can do as you please with the books you get printed.
If you are worried about someone stealing your work it sounds to me like you are really cutting corners to get things in print.
There's a "cheating" way to protect your work too. Package your work into some kind of envelope if you can. Mail it to yourself. Get the postmaster to place the cancelling seals on any and all seams of the package. Never open the package unless you have to take someone to court. The cancellation, and unopened envelope is your "copyright" in a sense. I did not say this very well, but hopefully you get the point. The date of cancellation is your copyright date. Stamping the seals of the envelope proves the thing has not been opened and closed many times....
Don't know if that would hold water in court, but it's better than nothing at all.
Check out what Trafford On-Demand publishing has to offer.
www.trafford.com
They set you up with an ISBN number, Library Of Congress number, copyright protection, a web page, .....but you still own all the rights and can do as you please with the books you get printed.
If you are worried about someone stealing your work it sounds to me like you are really cutting corners to get things in print.
There's a "cheating" way to protect your work too. Package your work into some kind of envelope if you can. Mail it to yourself. Get the postmaster to place the cancelling seals on any and all seams of the package. Never open the package unless you have to take someone to court. The cancellation, and unopened envelope is your "copyright" in a sense. I did not say this very well, but hopefully you get the point. The date of cancellation is your copyright date. Stamping the seals of the envelope proves the thing has not been opened and closed many times....
Don't know if that would hold water in court, but it's better than nothing at all.