Reincarnation

[-Carlos-]

Reincarnation is the belief that when one dies, one's body decomposes, but one is reborn in another body. It is the belief that one has lived before and will live again in another body after death.

Do you believe?

 

[FoxxyDeda]

No.

 

[ylris611203]

No, as well.

Another 'mature discussion' topic bites the dust.

 

[FoxxyDeda]

Maybe we should elaborate our answer to get things going a little?

No, I do not believe in any spiritual soul, paranormal, out of body kind of thing. I think you die, it is over, that is it.

We live forever through our descendants. Passing ahead our DNA and evolving like all other animals. That is all the continuation I need. The rest is make believe.

 

[ylris611203]

Good idea, elaborate .

I do believe in a 'soul' and I don't think that this is the end. But reincarnation, I don't think so.

I would be interested to know from someone who believes in reincarnation what would happen when the earth no longer exists for us to be reincarnated into.

The rest is make believe.

................not to everyone.

 

[FoxxyDeda]

I would be interested to know from someone who believes in reincarnation what would happen when the earth no longer exists for us to be reincarnated into.

Oh! I have read A LOT about all the religions going around today and I think I know a little bit about the general idea of reincarnation.
According to Allan Kardek, a guy who I think came up with a whole religion based on this idea(one of the many), there are a limited number of souls, that were created all at once, and they evolve as they reincarnate. We all start as vegetables, then animals, then humans and then, once we have evolved enough abandoning all or terrible ways, we go on to some other "level". So I guess when we are all done we wont need the earth any more...

But I agree, it would be interesting to hear from someone that believes in some version of this and knows a bit more...

 

[ylris611203]

We all start as vegetables, then animals, then humans ...

I wonder what sort of vegetable I started out as.

 

[Peronel]

No, I don't believe in the spiritual form of reincarnation. I do believe that when we die, we decompose and the atoms that once made up our physical selves will go on to become other things, and, as someone else has mentioned, our DNA lives on in any descendants.

Hello Peronel it appears that you have not posted on our forums in several weeks, why not take a few moments to ask a question, help provide a solution or just engage in a conversation with another member in any one of our forums?

Satisfied, remindy-robot?

 

[Rien]

I believe in reincarnation. Then again, I believe in belief, really. I think that the subconcious is capable of all sorts of things, and that the most logical way of viewing it all is that what you believe in happens. Atheists and agnostics go poof. Christians go to their own, slowly developed hell or heaven. And so forth.

 

[FoxxyDeda]

I think that the subconcious is capable of all sorts of things, and that the most logical way of viewing it all is that what you believe in happens. Atheists and agnostics go poof. Christians go to their own, slowly developed hell or heaven. And so forth.

See... my problem with this is that for it to be true the so called "subconscious" would have to be an independent thing, something that would not necessarily be connected to the brain. So really this is just another way of saying spirit or soul.
I do agree that what you think and believe have a lot to do with what happens to you, not in any "paranormal" way but only by the power of will. In my opinion this ends when the brain ends.

 

[ylris611203]

I believe in belief, really.

That may well be the answer.

Maybe atheists and agnostics are not able to believe; but then again an atheist will say that they don't believe in God, even though they have no proof that God does not exist.

So that must be a kind of belief anyway.

 

[FoxxyDeda]

but then again an atheist will say that they don't believe in God, even though they have no proof that God does not exist.
So that must be a kind of belief anyway.

This is a very odd argument and I have heard it so many times I wonder if people think about what they are saying or just repeat what they hear.
I will humor you anyway... I do not believe in the easter bunny either but, apart from the fact that I have never seen it, I have no proof the cute bunny isn't running around somewhere. So does that make me a believer in the non existence of the easter bunny?
The onus of proof falls on the ones that believe in something. Other else where do we stop? Can you prove that the pink unicorn does not exist??

 

[ylris611203]

I do not believe in the easter bunny either:..........The onus of proof falls on the ones that believe in something

I thought the easter bunny would figure in this somehow.

When someone believes in something, then proof is not needed. It is the non-believer who is always asking for proof.

If in your opinion

things ends when the brain ends

then that would be a belief, because you are not able to prove it to be true, this is also a bit easter bunny-ish.

 

[FoxxyDeda]

Well... I never asked for proof of anything. The believers are the ones who are always talking about proof and you are the one who brought it up.

What I say is: with the facts available to me at this moment I do not believe in anything spiritual. I do not believe in god or santa claus or the easter bunny. The only difference between these for me is that when we grow up we are expected to stop believing the former 2 but, for some reason, the belief in the first one is nurtured and supposed to be respected...

I know people who believe in elves, fairies or "forest creatures" today, this belief has been around for about as long as the the belief in god... We don't have any proof fairies are not around but somehow it is not fashionable or respected to believe in them.

Just because a lot more people believe in a spiritual god it does not make it more true. Argumentum ad Numerum is a fallacy as is the idea that "not to believe" is a form of belief.

 

[ylris611203]

Just because a lot more people believe in a spiritual god it does not make it more true. Argumentum ad Numerum is a fallacy as is the idea that "not to believe" is a form of belief.

Is the glass half full or half empty? Only one answer is correct. But unless you know the correct answer all you can do is believe it to be one or the other.

Likewise "not to believe" could be a fallacy, but to believe in nothing IS a belief.

 

[Rien]

I have to admit that Chris seems to have a more logical standpoint. If you had no belief whatsoever, then you wouldn't have an opinion. So I'm gonna have to go with the idea that atheists are believers, just in nothingness rather than somethingness.

Also, I wasn't talking about willpower. I was talking moreso about expectations. All sorts of things happen all the time, just because they're expected. I've seen people get flu-like symptoms during the flu season, because they just -knew- they'd catch it, yet when they go to the doctor, they're found to be in perfect health. Of course, the doctor tends to be considered a quack and wrong, but it happens too often for that to be the case all of the time. I figure that expectation builds the world, makes ripples, and why not lead into the afterlife? What else is going to go there? For you, nothing, but for me, something, I expect.

 

[FoxxyDeda]

Is the glass half full or half empty? Only one answer is correct. But unless you know the correct answer all you can do is believe it to be one or the other.

No, the glass either is more full then empty, vice versa or exactly at the middle. All you have to do is measure it. I don't need to believe anything until I know what is the correct answer.

Likewise "not to believe" could be a fallacy...

Can you tell me exactly how "not to believe" is a fallacy? That should be interesting...

but to believe in nothing IS a belief.

You can twist my words as much as you want. The fact that I do not believe in an after life does not mean that I need to replace that belief with anything else. Not even with the belief in nothingness.

I think this conversation has reached the point of going round and round... lets see if anyone else has something to say. It is getting boring.

 

[SevenWritez]

Well, I do believe in the afterlife--or some sort of spiritual realm--for things that have happened to my mother. I'll give two brief examples, point by point.

Example One:

-I was around seven years old when my grandfather died
-A week or so after the funeral--it was so long ago, I dont remember-- when I came to breakfeast, my mother was crying.
-I ask her what was wrong (stupid question, and I knew, but I was a kid)
-She tells me of her dream she had. Tidbit: at the time she was dating a man named Dave, who had spent the night. I find out from him later that he had the same exact one.
--She had a dream where at the foot of the bed she was sleeping in my grandpa was sitting down, staring at her (in Dave's dream he was staring at him).
--He told her: "Miha.miaha (However you spell it), I need to take someone with me."
--Three days later my Grandma died from a heart attack.

Example Two:

Two years ago.

--Mom comes down to breakfest
--She looks at me and says: "I think someones pregnant."
--I ask (duh): she says someone close to us.
--Later that day when my sister comes over with her husband, la de dum da, guess who's pregnant?


Now, those have nothing to do with reincarnation, but honestly, seeing as the whole IDEA of reincarnation has to do with things going in a circle, it's easy to assume that the arguments will go in the same way. Do I believe in reincarnation? Slightly, but only because of slight things that have happened in my own life which I won't mention, to keep this post from becoming longer than what it already possibly is.

I think my view leans a little towards what Rein said, saying the subconscious leads us to whatever we believed once our time has come and gone. Yet at the same time something in me refuses to accept a supernatural entity (or entities), resting above me.

So...what I'm saying, what I BELIEVE in, is that yes, there is something beyond what we see and comprehened, but it is also something that has never been truly explained or revealed in any text, any religious documentation, or any other hoo haw.

My two cents.

 

[FoxxyDeda]

I have to admit that Chris seems to have a more logical standpoint. If you had no belief whatsoever, then you wouldn't have an opinion.

What does opinion have to do with belief?? I do not believe in the "chupa cabras" but, in my opinion, it is a very scary story that works well to stop children wondering far away from the house at night in Brasil.
I have opinions about everything. I do not believe in everything though...

So I'm gonna have to go with the idea that atheists are believers, just in nothingness rather than somethingness.

Again... you do not have to replace a belief with another. Incredibly it is possible to simply not believe.

Also, I wasn't talking about willpower. I was talking more so about expectations. All sorts of things happen all the time, just because they're expected. I've seen people get flu-like symptoms during the flu season, because they just -knew- they'd catch it, yet when they go to the doctor, they're found to be in perfect health. Of course, the doctor tends to be considered a quack and wrong, but it happens too often for that to be the case all of the time. I figure that expectation builds the world, makes ripples, and why not lead into the afterlife? What else is going to go there?

I understood what you were talking about. You however apparently did not understand what I replied. What I said was that I am ok with all that because all the examples you used have to do with the life we know. The material side of it. Your body, the way you feel, how well you feel, all this are concrete things. Things that, even if we don't understand how, are controlled by our brains. So this all have to do with the fact that you are alive. Give me one example of this "power" affecting anything that is not concrete and you may have a case.

For you, nothing, but for me, something, I expect.

Hey! Best of luck to you there! Really, I am not an atheist fanatic. I hate fanatics in any form.

 

[ylris611203]

lets see if anyone else has something to say. It is getting boring.

If you feel it is getting boring you should just not respond, now it looks as if your argument does not hold up very well and you just want to have the last word.................ok that’s fine.