Another PC debate...sports mascots & names

[novella]

Well, the Seminole tribe formally approved the use of their name for a team, but the name Seminole is not considered offensive of course. One of their big chiefs has written that the PC name changes are just whitey baloney (I'm paraphrasing )

But there are some Indians who want the changes, like the author Sherman Alexie. He wrote something where he gave a lot of examples to illustrate how offensive it is, like:

The Houston Wetbacks (with a smiling Mexican cartoon guy in a sombrero)

or The Chicago Spics (similar picture)

or The New Jersey Wops (smiling mafios in a fedora)

The Boston Chinks (little Chinese guy with a braid down his back and a fu manchu mustache)

You get the idea. None of these would ever be used.

 

[sirmyk]

Native Americans are NOT redskins, nor are they braves.

Ask a 100 "Native Americans" what they would rather be called, and 99 will prefer the term "Indian" over "Native American", simply because the name "America" was established after us white folk (more tan, really) raped them of their land. How can they be natives of America, if the America part came second? That would be like the U.S. taking over Iraq, changing its name to Peaceville, and calling all Iraqians "Native Peacevillians". "Native American" in my opinion is a rather racist term.

African Americans use terms amongst themselves that are offensive when used by anyone else - I don't claim to understand but they feel that it's a way to reclaim power.

This is something I will never understand, considering I'm a white-milky-cracker-honkey-ma'fah. You will never hear me say, "What's up, my crackah?" I take a stand next to Bill Cosby when it comes to this.

If Native Americans don't like being thought of and referred to as Redskins in a world full of racists, why not accomodate them and make a change? No one will be hurt in the process.

California is over-accomodating. Just in Sacramento County there are roughly thirty tax-free Indian gaming casinos, maybe more.

 

[leckert]

Call me insensitive, and racist, and pigheaded, and a tool, I don't care.

Whatever happened to "Majority Rule"?

I don't hear tribes of "The people from whom we took our land" screaming and pleading for us to change the names of our sports teams?

I didn't hear them pleading to be called "Native Americans" either.

I think there is a small, well funded, vocal group in this country that feels they have some "Supreme Diety"-given duty to go around challenging anything they deem to be unfair. The PC population is so cowed by the play the media gives these groups, that we won't dare speak against their latest movement, or we might be considered "insensitive".

When do we say "Sit down and shut up! You are less than 1% of the population! Go Away!"?

 

[Renee]

Ask a 100 "Native Americans" what they would rather be called, and 99 will prefer the term "Indian" over "Native American", simply because the name "America" was established after us white folk (more tan, really) raped them of their land. How can they be natives of America, if the America part came second? That would be like the U.S. taking over Iraq, changing its name to Peaceville, and calling all Iraqians "Native Peacevillians". "Native American" in my opinion is a rather racist term.

Actually, having taken courses in Native American culture, having been married into a Native American family (my daughter is Native American), and having grown up and attended schools in a Native American community, I can say without hesitation, there is no agreement amongst the hundreds of tribes to which term is preferable. Some prefer Indian, some Native American, and many groups prefer neither. The Dene are not Native American or Indian, they are Dene, which isn't a tribal name. Some would prefer to be referred to by tribal affiliation.

Native American is cannot be a racist term when many find it a perfectly acceptable term, nor is it used in a demeaning way. Redskins on the other hand has been used in a demeaning and mocking way.

 

[mehastings]

I think the Yankees should be called the Fucking Assholes, but that's just me.

I'm going to stay out of this discussion, but I'd like to give a hearty thumbs up to this statement!

I'm just happy that my teams are named after a piece of clothing, an animal and a time period in American History! They'll never have to change!

 

[StillILearn]

Actually, having taken courses in Native American culture, having been married into a Native American family (my daughter is Native American), and having grown up and attended schools in a Native American community, I can say without hesitation, there is no agreement amongst the hundreds of tribes to which term is preferable. Some prefer Indian, some Native American, and many groups prefer neither. The Dene are not Native American or Indian, they are Dene, which isn't a tribal name. Some would prefer to be referred to by tribal affiliation.

Native American is cannot be a racist term when many find it a perfectly acceptable term, nor is it used in a demeaning way. Redskins on the other hand has been used in a demeaning and mocking way.

Thank you, Renee. My daughter is a Native American too. And, yes, there are a good many opinions about this particular subject. My daughter's people were once called "Diggers" (used in the same delightfully non-PC way in which the word "niggers" is now used), or more politely, Dieguenos (after a saint who never did any of them any good.

What they called themselves was "the People", Kumeyaay and/or Ipaii. There are only about 300 of them left now, but they were the people who were plentiful upon the land before the Spanish missionaries hove themselves ashore.

What I always told my children was that if a word hurts somebody, we don't use it, there being no particular paucity of words out there.

 

[KristoCat]

Like Moto, I can see both sides of the issue.

I go to the University of Illinois in Champaign, and our team mascot is Chief Illiniwek. A guy (usually white) dresses up in a costume designed by Native Americans and dances during halftime at sports games (the routine is, I hear, based on real tribal dances, which tribe I don't know). Many, many people around here are offended by this, while many, many more think it's great.

Native Americans themselves do not stand united on the issue either, and I agree with Moto that the merchandising aspect may be a huge factor in it. In fact, I have a feeling that if the University changed the mascot they would have lots of angry allumni refusing to buy stuff in Champaign anymore, and lots of Chief sweatshirts either becoming collecters's items or going to Goodwill. Money would be lost. Is this really an excuse? I don't know.

The issue divides the student population; it's a real hot button around here. There have been protests (mostly anti-Chief) and bumper stickers (mostly pro-Chief). There was even a student vote a couple of years ago, and if I remember correctly 60-70% of the students who bothered to vote wanted to keep the Chief.