Greatest Living British Author

[Stewart]

you might make more headway in educating people about "better" books through congradulations and suggestions, rather than a direct assault on their past choices

Do you think an adult deserves congratulations for reading Harry Potter?

 

[Motokid]

Sure. Why not? I see nothing wrong with people reading what they like to read. It's called entertainment for some people. I know that concept is hard to understand sometimes.

I certainly don't see a need to jump up and down, and scream about what a horrible choice they've made, and then go into a tirade about what a pathetic bunch of books the HP series is.

What's wrong with a pat on the back, and then saying, "Hey, if you liked those kinds of stories, you should look into reading......"?

Wouldn't that be a better approach than asking why they would waste their time and money reading such rubbish, and at the same time insinuating that the person obviously lacks intelligence, and has no taste?

 

[Kenny Shovel]

What's wrong with a pat on the back, and then saying, "Hey, if you liked those kinds of stories, you should look into reading......"?

Wouldn't that be a better approach than asking why they would waste their time and money reading such rubbish, and at the same time insinuating that the person obviously lacks intelligence, and has no taste?

Are you crazy? You're talking like someone who has a life outside online forums...this is life and death to some of us...

 

[Stewart]

It's called entertainment for some people. I know that concept is hard to understand sometimes.

Yes, Harry Potter is entertainment for some people. Those some people are called children.

I certainly don't see a need to jump up and down, and scream about what a horrible choice they've made, and then go into a tirade about what a pathetic bunch of books the HP series is.

Has anyone said that the Harry Potter... series is a pathetic bunch of books? Or is that your take on it?

 

[Shade]

Wow. You had to read a book 4 times before you could "really start getting something out of it"?

Sorry Moto, I was unclear. What I meant was that I had begun it three times before now, but never got very far. (Having said that, there are books that I have taken three or four reads to really feel I'm getting the most out of them, such as Jeanette Winterson's Art & Lies, or Martin Amis's The Information. Good books should give more with every read.)

I certainly don't think you can expect many people to put that much effort into anything, let alone reading

I don't see why not. The reason I persisted with Love in the Time of Cholera was because I could tell from previous attempts that Márquez was a really good writer, but that I just wasn't on the same wavelength at the time, or willing to make enough effort. Indeed I think I have used him before on the forum as an example of a writer who I think is objectively good but who I didn't enjoy. I also read one of his shorter works a few months ago which whetted my appetite to try again.

I just think to label something people have read as "crap" automatically puts others on the defensive, and you might make more headway in educating people about "better" books through congratulations and suggestions, rather than a direct assault on their past choices.

Open your eyes, Moto! I am constantly making suggestions and recommendations, and indeed my last post named half a dozen or more. Your point might be better made to those on 'the other side' of the argument. I don't remember naming any book as 'crap' or assaulting people on their choices, though I'm open to correction if you have more time to do a search than I do. I'm not seeking to 'educate' people and don't claim to be some sort of dispenser of ultimate literary wisdom. I have as much to learn about great books as anyone. However I do feel passionately that there's more to books than Karin Slaughter or Sidney Sheldon, to name two that I've seen real-life friends read recently: no evidence there of progressing to more interesting stuff, sadly.

...insinuating that the person obviously lacks intelligence, and has no taste?

You need to provide sources for this, Moto.

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[muggle]

Topic seems to be turning humorous which reminds me of a quote from Mark Twain:

Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please.

 

[Shade]

Sorry, I don't follow, muggle. Can you elaborate on the relevance of that? Do you mean in relation to Motokid accusing people of saying things they didn't say?

 

[Motokid]

Yes, Harry Potter is entertainment for some people. Those some people are called children.

Shade, do you not see comments like this as possibly being a bit insulting? What is the possible insinuation here?

 

[Zolipara]

Shade, do you not see comments like this as possibly being a bit insulting? What is the possible insinuation here?

Well they are marketed for children and you can find them in the childrens book section of the bookstore so it should not really come as a surprise.

 

[muggle]

Shade, do you not see comments like this as possibly being a bit insulting? What is the possible insinuation here?

Moto, more humorous than insulting. Surely you don't pay attention to stuff like that.

 

[Stewart]

Are you insulted, Moto?

 

[Zolipara]

and they sell in huge quantities.

If you look closely you might also notice some very small differences in the marketing effort/strategy to sell Harry Potter vs for instance the latest Salman Rushdie book.

 

[Kenny Shovel]

Technically breasts are only designed for young children too. Anybody feel too grown up for them?

 

[Shade]

No Moto that's irrelevant, your allegation of 'low intelligence' and 'no taste' came before Stewart said that. You need to find something from before that on this thread that backs up what you said (and also about me accusing someone or other here of reading "crap").

I'm not splitting hairs; it's important because I've been making my points on this thread (which wasn't even a disagreement until muggle took it as a criticism when I said I didn't think I would like Rowling's books as she's a children's author) without ever resorting to name-calling or insults (express or implied) to other posters. When you suggest that those things have been done, then it distracts from the arguments and misleads people who may be reading the thread from these posts forward, and doesn't help anyone.

 

[Stewart]

Technically breasts are only designed for young children too. Anybody feel too grown up for them?

But someone's got to test them before the kids get a hold of them. Like editors poring over Harry Potter.

 

[Motokid]

Are you insulted, Moto?

Nope. Not one bit.

I wasn't aware you read books for children.

I have two children and I am a published author of a children's picture book, so I have read plenty of books for children, but I have not read any of the HP series.

I just don't feel the need to call someone "childish" for reading, and enjoying the HP books, or any other book for that matter. People are free to read what they want, and they are certainly free to like what they want.

I wasn't aware you read books for children. Or adults, actually.

You just never seem to get tired of that joke do you?

No need for the little smilie my brotha....it's always assumed when you're responding to me.

 

[Stewart]

Nope. Not one bit.

Then why do you suppose my comment could be insulting. Is this the old Devil's Advocate trick again?

I just don't feel the need to call someone "childish" for reading, and enjoying the HP books, or any other book for that matter.

You say "childish" as if it's a quote from someone. Where is that quote from?

You just never seem to get tired of that joke do you?

As you can see above, I retracted the statement immediately upon making it.

 

[abecedarian]

No Moto that's irrelevant, your allegation of 'low intelligence' and 'no taste' came before Stewart said that. You need to find something from before that on this thread that backs up what you said (and also about me accusing someone or other here of reading "crap").

I'm not splitting hairs; it's important because I've been making my points on this thread (which wasn't even a disagreement until muggle took it as a criticism when I said I didn't think I would like Rowling's books as she's a children's author) without ever resorting to name-calling or insults (express or implied) to other posters. When you suggest that those things have been done, then it distracts from the arguments and misleads people who may be reading the thread from these posts forward, and doesn't help anyone.

Well said Shade. I do not feel insulted by any of the remarks made by any of the members who've pointed out that HP is a children's book. That's all they've done. As for the accusation that they need to offer suggestions for books..that's rediculous..These members offer more titles than one can read in a year.

 

[Shade]

I hate to harp on this, Moto, but Stewart's right, when you say

I just don't feel the need to call someone "childish" for reading, and enjoying the HP books

that suggests that someone has directly called others "childish" - that very word - for reading and enjoying the Harry Potter books. That has not happened, at least on this forum (there are 143 posts with the word childish in them, I checked...). To suggest it has is misleading and implies that people on 'this side' of the discussion are insulting others in that way, which they're not. It also suggests to others reading this thread that you don't have other points to make so resort to mud-slinging, which I am sure was not your intention.

 

[Motokid]

Then why do you suppose my comment could be insulting. Is this the old Devil's Advocate trick again?

You say "childish" as if it's a quote from someone. Where is that quote from?

Devil's Advocate, pot stirrer, troll, or simply just seeking a discussion with a group of people I've repeatedly referred to as the best reasons for still coming to TBF/BAR...whatever you wish to call it is fine with me.

I used the words "possibly" and "insinuate". I know that nobody in this specific thread had used specific words of condemnation. I'm simply stating that I can see how, through comments made here, and in other threads throughout the past 16-17 months, that people who enjoy certain books can be put on the defensive regarding certain comments that are made.

I also know who makes the most recommendations and who provides the best, most in-depth reviews around here. I read Martin Amis because of Shade. I read Yamm Martel (spelling?) because of Stewart. I read Lolita because of a both of them, and a few others around here.


If nobody else understands how a comment like this:

"Yes, Harry Potter is entertainment for some people. Those some people are called children."

could possibly be interpreted to mean that if I, as an adult who read and liked HP, have just been called a child, or childish, then I guess I just have a different way of looking at things.

Which, I'm sure others here will say that is a huge understatement.

So be it.