Guilty secret

[novella]

Why? Social security was never meant to be a retirement account.

I don't understand the question. In fact Social Security is now based on what you have earned in your lifetime. I don't think that's the best way to do it.

 

[Robert]

Hang on a sec. Who said anything about every kid in America going to university? There should be academically competitive placement with tough admissions standards and not everyone would get in. Frankly, I think what average dumb kid learns in a community college (vocational stuff and business accounting) should be taught in high school.

But a decent college should not cost 30K a year in after tax income just for tuition. Add room and board and books and expenses to that, and a kid needs 50K a year in after-tax money to attend a good university.

In Britain and Europe the best schools are affordable for everyone who gets in. A lot of them actually give stipends to students to live on.

And, yes, part of the Socialist picture is paying high taxes. I would start by taxing the pants off the richest 1%.

Do you know that the top 20 percent of earners already pay 80 percent of taxes? Did you know that the more you tax the rich, the less revenue is collected by the government because the higher the tax, the harder people look for shelters?

 

[novella]

Do you know that the top 20 percent of earners already pay 80 percent of taxes? Did you know that the more you tax the rich, the less revenue is collected by the government because the higher the tax, the harder people look for shelters?

Yeah, but the top 20% includes people who can't pay for college. I oughta know, as we pay about 60% of income in taxes. I'm talking about the filthy rich 1%. And frankly if the government won't shut the loopholes and shelters its only because their biggest campaign donors will flip out (see GWB for details). What's wrong with that picture?

 

[Robert]

I don't understand the question. In fact Social Security is now based on what you have earned in your lifetime. I don't think that's the best way to do it.

Yes, I know how it works. The question is why isn't the current method the best way to do it? Social Security is not a tax for wealth redistribution. Each person has their own account. It's not meant to be a retirement account, it's not meant to be income for people to live off of, it's just a supplement, so what difference does it make? What's wrong with getting out of something only what they put into it?

 

[Motokid]

I would start by taxing the pants off the richest 1%.

I know this is the battle cry for just about every American...but the rich are rich because they are smart. They know how to spend, save and make money. So the smartest, wealthiest people in the world should all be penalized for being smart and wealthy? Is that fair?

That's why I like a flat tax. It's the only fair thing to do. Take 25% or whatever from every single living, earning person. Period. No shelters, no tax breaks, no loopholes. Flat tax.

Don't "punish" the smart. Be fair to all.

 

[Robert]

Yeah, but the top 20% includes people who can't pay for college. I oughta know, as we pay about 60% of income in taxes. I'm talking about the filthy rich 1%. And frankly if the government won't shut the loopholes and shelters its only because their biggest campaign donors will flip out (see GWB for details). What's wrong with that picture?

Actually, that GWB thing is another lie from the media. Kerry collected a hell of a lot more then Mr. Bush, had the richest contributors, and the largest number of wealthy contributors.

 

[novella]

I know this is the battle cry for just about every American...but the rich are rich because they are smart. They know how to spend, save and make money. So the smartest, wealthiest people in the world should all be penalized for being smart and wealthy? Is that fair?

That's why I like a flat tax. It's the only fair thing to do. Take 25% or whatever from every single living, earning person. Period. No shelters, no tax breaks, no loopholes. Flat tax.

Don't "punish" the smart. Be fair to all.

That's not accurate. Inherited wealth is a huge segment of that population. These are corporate dynasties, not families.

 

[Motokid]

Actually, that GWB thing is another lie from the media. Kerry collected a hell of a lot more then Mr. Bush, had the richest contributors, and the largest number of wealthy contributors.

I beg to differ...everything I've read points to G Dubbya having the greatest monetary donation gathering power of any living human being on the planet who's run for political office.

I read "The Buying of the President 2004" ( I think that was the title, I can look it up if you'd like) which stated the donations of all the political candidates and where they came from....and Dubbya lead them all by leaps and bounds....

edit: here's the title and author (The Buying Of The President 2004 by Charles Lewis) ..I'd bet you can find it in your library. I started a thread on it but only novella and I posted...this book goes into detail on every candidate, sparing no one, but with emphasis on both Dubbya and Kerry since they were the odds on favorites. I could see no political bias towards any party in this book. This guy had nothing to gain or lose by picking favorites.

 

[Motokid]

That's not accurate. Inherited wealth is a huge segment of that population. These are corporate dynasties, not families.

Taxing inheritance is government theft and robbery in my opinion. A person goes through life earning money and paying taxes on it. Then when they die, the survivors have to pay taxes on what's left???? That's just bullshit in my opinion. That's double taxation on the same money. Taxes were already paid on that money when it was originally earned, and the interest it accumulated while the original earner was still alive.

 

[Robert]

I beg to differ...everything I've read points to G Dubbya having the greatest monetary donation gathering power of any living human being on the planet who's run for political office.

I read "The Buying of the President 2004" ( I think that was the title, I can look it up if you'd like) which stated the donations of all the political candidates and where they came from....and Dubbya lead them all by leaps and bounds....

edit: here's the title and author (The Buying Of The President 2004 by Charles Lewis) ..I'd bet you can find it in your library. I started a thread on it but only novella and I posted...this book goes into detail on every candidate, sparing no one, but with emphasis on both Dubbya and Kerry since they were the odds on favorites. I could see no political bias towards any party in this book. This guy had nothing to gain or lose by picking favorites.

I'll dig something up on it later. There was a lot in the news about Kerry having more money and Democrats being angry with him because he held so much back that they feel he could have won.

 

[novella]

Taxing inheritance is government theft and robbery in my opinion. A person goes through life earning money and paying taxes on it. Then when they die, the survivors have to pay taxes on what's left???? That's just bullshit in my opinion. That's double taxation on the same money. Taxes were already paid on that money when it was originally earned, and the interest it accumulated while the original earner was still alive.

I'm not talking about inheritance tax. I'm talking about taxing the huge incomes made by people with inherited wealth, which is a completely different thing.

Aside from that, inheritances should be taxed as gift to those individuals who inherit, with the exception of the resale value of agricultural land. This is not double taxation, as by definition it is going to a new person who has not paid taxes on it. To view it as individual dollars that have already had their share of income tax paid is simplistic. Furthermore, you are merely defending greed. The richest people can easily afford to pay more.

At the philosophical level it might appear to be fair, but on a practical level the enormous greed of the few in the face of the instability and lack of basics like housing and medicine by the many is at obscene proportions at the moment.

 

[MonkeyCatcher]

but the rich are rich because they are smart.

I disagree, and I can sum my arguement up in two words. Paris Hilton

~MonkeyCatcher~

 

[bobbyburns]

I disagree. paris hilton is a robot made by humans.

 

[Robert]

I beg to differ...everything I've read points to G Dubbya having the greatest monetary donation gathering power of any living human being on the planet who's run for political office.

I read "The Buying of the President 2004" ( I think that was the title, I can look it up if you'd like) which stated the donations of all the political candidates and where they came from....and Dubbya lead them all by leaps and bounds....

edit: here's the title and author (The Buying Of The President 2004 by Charles Lewis) ..I'd bet you can find it in your library. I started a thread on it but only novella and I posted...this book goes into detail on every candidate, sparing no one, but with emphasis on both Dubbya and Kerry since they were the odds on favorites. I could see no political bias towards any party in this book. This guy had nothing to gain or lose by picking favorites.

Looks like you were right. Bush did indeed have more to spend.

 

[Robert]

I'm not talking about inheritance tax. I'm talking about taxing the huge incomes made by people with inherited wealth, which is a completely different thing.

Aside from that, inheritances should be taxed as gift to those individuals who inherit, with the exception of the resale value of agricultural land. This is not double taxation, as by definition it is going to a new person who has not paid taxes on it. To view it as individual dollars that have already had their share of income tax paid is simplistic. Furthermore, you are merely defending greed. The richest people can easily afford to pay more.

At the philosophical level it might appear to be fair, but on a practical level the enormous greed of the few in the face of the instability and lack of basics like housing and medicine by the many is at obscene proportions at the moment.

People that are rich are rich because they're smart. There is some old money sure, but there is a lot of new wealth out there as well. There is nothing wrong with people getting rich, nothing wrong with the rich getting richer. Rich people have nothing to do with lack of the basics. Medicine is costly because of lawyers, greedy people with get rich schemes and their garbage lawsuites.

 

[Kenny Shovel]

I disagree. paris hilton is a robot made by humans.

The real question is why, and how come they used such cheap looking materials?

 

[Kenny Shovel]

In Britain there are caps on how much money can be raised and spent on electioneering . All of which saves a lot of fuss and nonesence as polititans are so much easier to buy.

 

[Robert]

In Britain there are caps on how much money can be raised and spent on electioneering . All of which saves a lot of fuss and nonesence as polititans are so much easier to buy.

I see. The price was brought down by law so the common person can afford to buy his or her own politician. How very nice.

 

[Kenny Shovel]

Sure, why should corporations have all the fun, it’s democracy in action.
You know for three days last week Britain was officially at war with the cast of ‘Friends’ and that only cost me £50. For another twenty I could have had David Scwimmer killed, and looking back I think that’s very much a missed opportunity on my part.

 

[Robert]

Sure, why should corporations have all the fun, it’s democracy in action.
You know for three days last week Britain was officially at war with the cast of ‘Friends’ and that only cost me £50. For another twenty I could have had David Scwimmer killed, and looking back I think that’s very much a missed opportunity on my part.

Damn, Kenny. I’ll have to remember never to announce my overseas travel plans.