imprecise language

[Billy]

There are quite a few things that annoy me with the way people use, or should I say mutilate, the English language. Thinking back to Jemima's first post about the person who got decenders confused with dissenters, you mentioned, Jem, that you wouldn't have expected this from university level students, ie. that they would forget that in English there is a difference between the 'd' sound and the 't' sound. I am constantly amazed at the amount of people who have completed bloody English degress at university and still haven't figured out that there is a difference between the 'th' sound and the 'f' sound. It drives me insane to hear a so-called educated person ask me to pass them "free pieces of paper" instead of "three pieces". Another one that gets to me is the use of the word "yous". The word doesn't exist!

Also for another example, I can't stand it when someone says to me, "I didn't do nothing!" I usually explain to them that that is the whole point. They didn't do nothing and therefore they did something. This usually confuses them, so I give up.

And the latest thing is the way 'so' is now being used. "I so want to do that!" or "That is so not good." I understand that so is being used as a word to add emphasis, but it is just so not right.

 

[Miss Shelf]

This thread reminds me of something I read and saved to my computer:

REASONS WHY THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE IS SO HARD TO LEARN
1. The bandage was wound around the wound.
2. The farm was used to produce produce.
3. The dump was so full that it had to refuse more refuse.
4. We must polish the Polish furniture.
5. He could lead if he would get the lead out.
6. The soldier decided to desert his dessert in the desert.
7. Since there is no time like the present, he thought it was time to
present the present.
8. A bass was painted on the head of the bass drum.
9. When shot at, the dove dove into the bushes.
10. I did not object to the object.
11. The insurance was invalid for the invalid.
12. There was a row among the oarsmen about how to row.
13. They were too close to the door to close it.
14. The buck does funny things when the does are present.
15. A seamstress and a sewer fell down into the sewer.
16. To help with planting, the farmer taught his sow to sow.
17. The wind was too strong to wind the sail.
18. After a number of injections my jaw got number.
19. Upon seeing the tear in the painting, I shed a tear.
20. I had to subject the subject to a series of tests.
21. How can I intimate this to my most intimate friend?

Let's face it - English is a crazy language.

There is no egg in eggplant nor ham in hamburger, neither apple nor pine
in pineapple.

English muffins weren't invented in England or French fries in France.

Sweetmeats are candies while sweetbreads, which aren't sweet, are meat.

We take English for granted. But if we explore its paradoxes, we find that
quicksand can work slowly, boxing rings are square and a guinea pig is
neither from Guinea nor is it a pig.

And why is it that writers write but fingers don't fing, grocers don't
groce and hammers don't ham?

If the plural of tooth is teeth, why isn't the plural of booth beeth? One
goose, two ! geese. So one moose, two meese? One index, two indices?

Doesn't it seem crazy that you can make amends but not one amend? If you
have a bunch of odds and ends and get rid of all but one of them, what do
you call it?

If teachers taught, why didn't preachers praught? If a vegetarian eats
vegetables, what does a humanitarian eat?

Sometimes I think all English speakers should be committed to an asylum
for the verbally insane.

In what language do people recite a play and play at a recital? Ship by
truck and send cargo by ship? Have noses that run and feet that smell? How can a slim chance and a fat chance be the same, while a wise man and a
wise guy are opposites?

You have to marvel at the unique lunacy of a language in which your house
can burn up as it burns down, in which you fill in a form by filling it out
and in which, an alarm goes off by going on.

English was invented by people and not computers and it reflects the
creativity of the human race, which, of course, is not a race at all.

That is why, when the stars are out, they are visible, but when the lights
are out, they are invisible.

P.S. Why doesn't BUICK rhyme with QUICK?

 

[Jemima Aslana]

Miss Shelf, I saw that one some time ago. I think it's been out there for quite some time by now Still amusing though.

Billy, about the three/free problem: Some people simply can't produce the 'th' sound. It is a physical impossibility for them. Just like others can't make a rolling 'r' (which is very common in Denmark - because the Danish language has only dry r's and no rolling ones) Also the other 'th' sound can cause problems - especially for people who don't have that sound in their language - the Dutch for instance have I heard make that mistake often: "My modder went out in de horrible weadder to meet dem" It's not unheard of Listen closely to Within Temptation and you'll find the chick making such slips now and then.

But generally I can tolerate such things as long as they don't confuse meaning.

As it has become so popular to say: I could care less <--- a huge pet peeve of mine, similar to your "didn't do nothing"

 

[Twilite]

A very amusing read, thank you!

I have a little pet hate of my own, which is the misuse of apostrophes. The lack of them I can tolerate (just!), but putting them in the wrong places frustrates me a lot. There was a sign at work, a relatively successful tourist attraction that read; "Please leave your mat's here". That's so (opps!) obviously wrong it's embarrassing.

Speaking of badly written signs, there's a book of them I had a flick through once, and the one on the cover, from a zoo, read; "Elephants Stay In Your Cars". Made me chuckle.
There's also a punctuation joke regarding a panda, but I won't bore you with it!

 

[MonkeyCatcher]

I /hate/ it when people say "free" instead of "three". Mispronouncing words is definately one of my pet hates (mispronounced by people who have English as their first language, of course...). I also hate it when people say "newst" instead of "used", or "I would of" instead of "I would have". Petty kind of person, huh?

Along the lines of signs translated incorrectly, I once saw a picture taken in an asian hotel where instead of saying "Fire Exit", the sign said "Death Trap".

I found a link to a picture of some packaging on a product which has not been translated too well - here it is

 

[Miss Shelf]

A very amusing read, thank you!

I have a little pet hate of my own, which is the misuse of apostrophes. The lack of them I can tolerate (just!), but putting them in the wrong places frustrates me a lot. There was a sign at work, a relatively successful tourist attraction that read; "Please leave your mat's here". That's so (opps!) obviously wrong it's embarrassing.

I hate that too! When I see misplaced apostrophes on signs outside fast food restaurants I'm tempted to throw something at the sign.

What's even worse is when the local news misspells words or they misplace apostrophes in their graphics that are below the newscaster. And one of these days I'm going to have a highlighter with me when I read my local paper and I'm going to highlight every mistake and mail the newspaper back to the editor. Yeah, I know, I'm becoming a crank. It's fun!

 

[Libre]

I hate an expression that has become popular - How XXXX is that? Like, How cool is that? How stupid is that? I can't stand that expression. How annoying is that?
At the end of the day. People are saying that all over the place now. I hate it. At the end of the day. BAH - a horrible expression that has become ubiquitous.
My MOST despised expression (and I sheepishly admit to inadvertantly using it myself) is "and stuff like that".
Think about it. Say anything, anything, anything, anything ... and stuff like that. It conveys nothing. I make a conscious effort to never use that inane expression, and stuff like that.

 

[Miss Shelf]

that reminds me of my mom's pet peeve,when people begin a sentence with "You know". My oldest brother kept saying that (and he's over 50-I blame his kids) and she finally said "no, I don't know!". Not sure if he's making an effort to stop saying "You know". it's hard, you know?

 

[MonkeyCatcher]

Oh, I find it irritating when people say "Wow, you'll never guess what happened", upon which I reply "Oh, what" and they say "No, guess". I mean, they just stated that I would never be able to guess, so what's the point!

 

[Billy]

What's even worse is when the local news misspells words or they misplace apostrophes in their graphics that are below the newscaster. And one of these days I'm going to have a highlighter with me when I read my local paper and I'm going to highlight every mistake and mail the newspaper back to the editor. Yeah, I know, I'm becoming a crank. It's fun!

What I find really funny is when the news readers on TV get their words mixed up and it actually gives a whole different meaning to what they are supposed to be saying. We have a really poisonous spider called the funnelweb. Many years ago a newsreader was reporting on someone being bitten and he said: "A woman from ***** was bitten on the funnel by a fingerweb spider."

But seriously it annoys me when I see things spelt incorrectly in any kind of print media. Only today I was reading a brochure and was shocked by the amount of words spelt incorrectly. One would have been bad enough, but I actually noticed about 4. These things are supposed to be checked and editted.

 

[Halo]

What's starting to irritate me is when people say "... was like" instead of "said". Example:

Teenage girl relating conversation:

So, I was like, "You what?"
And he was like, "You heard me."
And I was like, "You've gotta be kidding me." etc.

Just use the word "said"!

And yes, I'm afraid I am another person who goes around spotting and becoming annoyed by wrongly used/missing apostrophes.

 

[Twilite]

Another phrase I've just remembered I hate, mostly because my mum says it so badly is "...do you know what I mean?". Not sure if it's my common family, but people say it a lot and it really bugs me. My mum isn't particularly common, she usually enunciates quite well but she always pronounces this phrase as "Jannitaameen?!"
Grrr.

 

[Ice]

I am constantly amazed at the amount of people who have completed bloody English degress at university and still haven't figured out that there is a difference between the 'th' sound and the 'f' sound. It drives me insane to hear a so-called educated person ask me to pass them "free pieces of paper" instead of "three pieces".

Now here I will disagree, not just because people can have trouble pronouncing certain combinations of words, but I feel your background also plays a part. Just because people say 'free' instead of 'three' does not mean they are illiterate or uneducated (referring to your so-called educated person comment) It depends on what part of the country you are from, here I am thinking of London. At school you learn to talk like your peers, if the majority say 'free' as oppose to 'three' then you will pick up the same. Not withstanding the fact you may be picked on or singled out as a 'posh bitch' or a 'snobby cow' if you don't (children can be harsh) but children tend to pick up on what is being said around them. I have a couple of friends who have moved to Scotland - now their child has picked up the accent already from being at school there. People from different areas do talk differently - I am reminded of the difference between 'laugh' mostly - down here we say larf and up north they say laff - who is right? Are one of us uneducated because we pronounce things differently?

How about the differences in path, glass and castle? Would northerners be looked down upon because they say cassle as oppose to castle? Are they uneducated because they don't pronounce the t?

Like Jemima, I accept that people speak or pronounce words differently and as long as the meaning isn't confused then that is fine

 

[abecedarian]

I have an uncle who says "firty-free" instead of thirty-three and "mannonaise" instead of mayonaise..he's not highly educated, but we love him anyway.
Then there's my mil, who has several hours beyond a master's degree in education and taught school for a billion years( ok, maybe it was closer to 40), and she says "tuckerware" for Tupperware, and she says "Flicker" when the name is Fricker, and then there's the "prostrate" gland when she means prostate

My dh used have co-worker named Jackie. She was the queen of mispronounciations. They called her best goof ups "Jackie-isms". Here's one that I remember most: Several years ago, in Florida, they were having trouble with freezing temperatures that threatened to kill of the "syphilis trees".

 

[Libre]

Now here I will disagree, not just because people can have trouble pronouncing certain combinations of words, but I feel your background also plays a part. Just because people say 'free' instead of 'three' does not mean they are illiterate or uneducated (referring to your so-called educated person comment) It depends on what part of the country you are from, here I am thinking of London. At school you learn to talk like your peers, if the majority say 'free' as oppose to 'three' then you will pick up the same.

I'm not sure I go along with this. Educated people speak a certain way, for the most part. If you mangle words and especially if you use them imprecisely, you will be grouped with the dunces.

I can't get comfortable with the fact that George W. Bush can't correctly pronounce nuclear, and consistently says "nookyouler". I think he should at least learn how to say the names of the weapons, with which he could wipe out all life on Earth.

 

[Ice]

I'm not sure I go along with this. Educated people speak a certain way, for the most part. If you mangle words and especially if you use them imprecisely, you will be grouped with the dunces.

I am not talking about using words which give an incorrect meaning, I am merely talking about pronunciation. Saying 'free' as oppose to 'three' does not make you a dunce - it merely means that you grew up around people who pronounced it that way. I know several people who have degrees, masters, doctorates who say it like this because they grew up in London - I certainly wouldn't class any of them dunces anymore than I would class a northerner dunce for pronouncing castle 'cassle'

 

[abecedarian]

I am not talking about using words which give an incorrect meaning, I am merely talking about pronunciation. Saying 'free' as oppose to 'three' does not make you a dunce - it merely means that you grew up around people who pronounced it that way. I know several people who have degrees, masters, doctorates who say it like this because they grew up in London - I certainly wouldn't class any of them dunces anymore than I would class a northerner dunce for pronouncing castle 'cassle'

we also have people of all manner of education levels who say "warsh" for wash and "crick" for creek. It's just a matter of where one is from, or atleast where the ones who raised us is from.. I got in trouble in middle school once for asking who was bringing the "fixins" for a picnic outing. I meant the side dishes like potato salad or baked beans. My mom was from Georgia and my dad from Oklahoma..my classmates thought I sounded too much like a hick..

 

[The Prussian]

Libre:

What you described in your OP was a power play. You are dealing with an individual in a position of little power who asserts any power he has in any way he can. You were just the latest victim of his sh*tty attitude.

 

[Libre]

I am not talking about using words which give an incorrect meaning, I am merely talking about pronunciation. Saying 'free' as oppose to 'three' does not make you a dunce - it merely means that you grew up around people who pronounced it that way. I know several people who have degrees, masters, doctorates who say it like this because they grew up in London - I certainly wouldn't class any of them dunces anymore than I would class a northerner dunce for pronouncing castle 'cassle'

So, you're not the least bit uncomfortable when you hear G.W. Bush say "nucular". Well, that's you then. I grew up in Queens, New York, not London. In these parts, people might say "tree" instead of "three". They might say "dese", "dem" and "dose" instead of "these", "them", and "those". We call that a Brooklyn accent. Still, there are many that grow up in Brooklyn and they learn to pronounce words properly. I admire good speech, and I don't admire poor speech, or, as in the title of this thread, imprecise speech. I don't say that a person is a dunce merely because he (or she) lacks linguistic accuracy. But what DOES it say about them? Nothing very positive.
Awwww - fugedabowdit.

 

[MonkeyCatcher]

So, you're not the least bit uncomfortable when you hear G.W. Bush say "nucular".

Just the fact that Bush was re-elected makes me uncomfortable...


Edited after remembering about the politics thing..