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J.D. Salinger: The Catcher In The Rye

Interestingly, I thought one of the themes of Catcher was "fitting in" and one of the reasons its so popular is because people are constantly faced with people they disagree with, and they need to decide "Do I say something, or do I keep quiet to fit in?" It's a situtation that occurs frequently.


Should you call someone sarcastic, when they are clearly being sarcastic? Is it "phony" not to? Is it worth it? What happens to someone who speaks out against every person they consider "phony"?

Holden always makes think of Kurt Cobain: definitely not "phony," but Cobain's story defintely didn't end happily either. Salinger himself doesn't exactly "fit in." No happy ending for him either.
 
novella said:
The question is, why is he like that? Why does he wish that?
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We studied this in school years ago, and the way it was presented to me was that Holden was having a difficult time making the transition to adulthood. He only related well to children, had a deep affection and sense of responsibility toward them, and he viewed them all as heading toward a cliff they were all doomed to fall off. The cliff was adulthood. By catching them before they fell off that cliff, he would be saving them from pain, and keeping them pure. So essentially he was wishing he could be the one to keep all children safe and young.
 
namedujour said:
We studied this in school years ago, and the way it was presented to me was that Holden was having a difficult time making the transition to adulthood. He only related well to children, had a deep affection and sense of responsibility toward them, and he viewed them all as heading toward a cliff they were all doomed to fall off. The cliff was adulthood. By catching them before they fell off that cliff, he would be saving them from pain, and keeping them pure. So essentially he was wishing he could be the one to keep all children safe and young.
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namedujour,
That is a vey nice presentation of what I only dimly saw when I read the book on my own. And, at that, only his desire to protect them from falling off the cliff, which I found very emotionally powerful. Now I am motivated to read it again, and this time with much greater understanding.
Thank you :)
Peder
 
just finished reading this book

hi, i just finshed reading this book may be 5 hours ago. i had to read it for school. my brother kept telling me to read it during summer and all but i was like what ever. the reason why i read ahead of the class and finshed the book a week ahead was i kept hearing that the book influenced a lot of killers and its there favoraite book. but i totaly dont see how that happens. after hearing that i expected a TOATLY differnt ending. but it liked it tho. sorta confusing for me but a good booK!!!
 
phaze said:
i kept hearing that the book influenced a lot of killers and its there favoraite book.
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The only "killer" I know of that liked the book was that guy who tried to assassinate Regan (don't know his name - I'm not too flash on all things American ;) ).

I don't buy into the "influenced" thing, though. It's as rediculous as trying to assert that video games make people go on shooting sprees :rolleyes:
 
MonkeyCatcher said:
The only "killer" I know of that liked the book was that guy who tried to assassinate Regan (don't know his name - I'm not too flash on all things American ;) ).

I don't buy into the "influenced" thing, though. It's as rediculous as trying to assert that video games make people go on shooting sprees :rolleyes:
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Two others I know of are the guy who killed John Lennon and the guy who stalked Jodi Foster. I think the person who shot Reagan was a woman named Squeaky Fromme and I don't think she had Catcher on her at the time.

I don't think the book influenced these nuts, but obviously something in the book appealed to them. Maybe it's Holden's conviction that he is always right and the arbiter of who is worthy and who is not, in addition to his emotional isolation.
 
novella said:
the guy who stalked Jodi Foster.
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Oh, that's the guy I meant. I thought that he tried to kill someone to impress her, and I'm sure it was Reagan? :confused:
I was under the impression that Squeaky Fromme was one of Charles Manson's acolytes and she was in on the murder of Sharon Tate in 1969. She was still in prison for that in 1981 when the attempt was made on Reagan. At least, that is what I thought :confused:
 
i really loved and related with the book when i was 12. i think thats saying something..

one of my friends really couldn't stand it. she thought all he did was whine. i didn't really feel like pointing out that most of our conversations revolve around her complaints about something.

i've read it about 3-4 times. i guess you could say i'm "sick" of it now.. considering how in depth my 10th grade english teacher went with this novel. she absolutely loved holden and i could also see why.

its also an interesting piece of literature to read about someone "crashing" without it being like The Bell Jar. you just know that ester will end up in the hospital while reading the Bell Jar. many teenagers relate with Catcher in the Rye since i think most people do go through a time where they're just literally wandering aimlessly, trying to find some sort of desire to wake up next morning.

the one scene that will never leave me was with the one boy jumping out of the window wearing holden's turtleneck.
 
novella said:
I find the same is true for many kids reading The Catcher in the Rye. For some reason, they see only parts of Holden's experience, but miss the big picture completely.
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i agree. one of my friends hated this book. she could go on and on about how all Holden did was whine. she definalty missed "the big picture"
 
I remember reading this book in highschool and being turned off by Holden's negativity. On the other hand my other peers thought he was "super cool" or something to that effect.

For some reason, they see only parts of Holden's experience, but miss the big picture completely.
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Generally Holden is depressed and antisocial and many kids can relate to his emotional turmoil and constant plight with "phoniness". However, most kids (that I knew) do not have the emotional perspective to really understand the big picture. In my oppinion CITR does not offer much clarification for its readers. At least that age group of readers.
 
hal9000 said:
Maybe Thea is referring to the overall meaning and ideology in a given theme, not incorrect interpretations of locutions.
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Yup. Sorry it took me over a year to get back to you on that, though. :eek:
 
Pi Embarking His Place With Religion and God

This was such a cute book and beautifully written. Pi is an interesting character that's been through so much-(exploring, confronting, etc.) The author brilliantly merged so many aspects of life and spirituality in the book. When Pi goes off to search for the truth of God, he's initially a Hindu but then finds about Christianity and starts contrasting it to what he was brought up on. Then, he spends time learning about Islam. He considers himself a devotee to all the religions but after being told that this can't be done, he says that he just loves God. They included Judaism in the book too, though he hadn't had time to convert into it. :p Funny book, a must read!
 
Seeing as Mark Chatman was reading it while he waited for the police after he shot John Lennon, maybe its not such as fantastic nomination for this month or week...
 
BenjaminDixon said:
Seeing as Mark Chatman was reading it while he waited for the police after he shot John Lennon, maybe its not such as fantastic nomination for this month or week...
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It was nominated a year ago ;)
 
BenjaminDixon said:
Seeing as Mark Chatman was reading it while he waited for the police after he shot John Lennon, maybe its not such as fantastic nomination for this month or week...
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Why on earth would you think that? Would you think it would turn us into assassins or something?

The connection between the two is coincidental at best. The book was controversial from the get go anyway, and thus the media pounced on it as an interesting element. If Chapman had a copy of Enid Blyton's 'Magic Faraway Tree' I'm sure little would have been heard. For example who was the designer of his shoes? No idea? Well, that's because it's not deemed important. The antisocial tendencies of Holden appealed to Chapman, so he liked the book. All the brew-ha-ha since then is little more than people who've been inspired by Chapman (eg: Reagan's would-be assassin) or like to play upon the concept of this book being more than it is.
 
I disliked this book. I only read it recently and would have stopped had it not been so short anyway, and a firm favourite among most people (definitely making every respected 'greatest books of all time' lists and suchlike).

I think that had I read it as a teenager, it might have appealed more. It had a very teen-style approach (obviously), with the language, moods, thoughts, feelings etc of typical (or atypical) teens being portrayed. Had I been in my thirties, and reminiscent of years gone by and all that, I might have liked it. Forties - being a parent of a teen, and so on.

However, being in my twenties, I found it boring and immature. I can see how it would appeal to antisocial/immature people such as those mentioned here, or to people who are in a position to be empathetic towards Holden (and teens).

Having said that, I am glad I completed it. I think perhaps it may be one of those books that you don't quite forget...
 
The Catcher In The Rye

Anyone want to talk about this book? I loved the book and laughed out loud many times while reading it. This is my first post on here and all i can say is what a cool forum! -Kenny....San Diego, CA
 
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