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Jimi Hendrix - say it isn't so....Un-American?

Robert said:
It's just like the vote, Kenny, everybody counts. Part of having freedom must include doing what is necessary to protect it.
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And the freedom to choose what causes you believe in and are willing to die for, surely? Which war was he supposed to go to, anyway? Korea or Vietnam? Let's not get started on the 'necessity' of those, shall we?

I never thought of Hendrix as a hero anyway. So he played a damn good guitar and was the 'sound of a generation'. Doesn't make him venerable on the 'hero' scale, IMHO. Frankly, I can't say I wouldn't do the same thing he did. He probably got more out of going into the military than he would have in prison, and if there was a loophole to get out of a war I didn't believe in, I'd sure as hell take it - particularly one as ridiculous as being rejected if you're gay! Ha ha ha ha ha!! Man, they were so short sighted in the '70's. Oh, wait a minute...
 
Motokid said:
The things Jimi did are not "human" things. They are big. They are dis-honorable. They are un-American.
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Genuine question, what exactly does un-american mean? I've never really understood that.
 
It's a wonderful catch phrase isn't it????

If you want to live here, and reap the benefits and rewards of living here and working here, then there are some basic simple things you need to do. Pay taxes. Don't f the country. Don't rely on the country and it's systems to save your ass, then run for the cover of another country when America needs you....those kinds of things....

If you don't like it here leave. But don't bend the country over, have your way with her, then run away when things get a bit tough. Have some respect and honor for where you live, especially when where you live provides you with so much.
 
Ok, so it's being a bad citizen or being un-patriotic then. So someone acting like this in Holland would be un-Dutch.
 
Motokid said:
It's a wonderful catch phrase isn't it????

If you want to live here, and reap the benefits and rewards of living here and working here, then there are some basic simple things you need to do. Pay taxes. Don't f the country. Don't rely on the country and it's systems to save your ass, then run for the cover of another country when America needs you....those kinds of things....

If you don't like it here leave. But don't bend the country over, have your way with her, then run away when things get a bit tough. Have some respect and honor for where you live, especially when where you live provides you with so much.
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This doesn't leave a whole lot of room for expressing your own thoughts and opinions and trying to bring about change. According to your definition it seems one has to conform and get into line in order to be considered an American. Sounds like Hendrix was 'unAmerican' to me!
 
There are ways to go about expressing yourself and creating change.

Hendrix stole cars. That's against the law. He got caught. His punishment was either prison or serve in the military. He chose the military. Fine. Serve your time and go about your life. But then he chose to lie about his sexual orientation to get out of his service to his country. That's wrong. Thats deceitful. That's cowardly.

Was Martin Luther King a coward? No. He stood up for what was right in the face of adversity and personal suffering.

As was mentioned earlier, Jimmy Stewarts behavior is exemplary (spelling).

Freedom of speech does not allow you to yell fire in a theater or make bomb jokes on an airplane.

Freedom to assemble does not mean you can block traffic and handcuff yourself to the whitehouse gates.

There are ways and means to go about creating change. There are ways and means to make a stand.

What Hendrix did was not the way or the means.
 
I just wanted to put in that now days being gay doesn't immediately get you out, they have a don't ask don't tell policy meaning you would have to be acting out, usually in a very perverse or harassing manner, to get out. My husband has served with a few men that were gay and as long as they kept their sex lives to themselves as they are all expected to do these days, no one had much of a problem with it. I don't know how it was in Jimi's day but since some were comparing that to todays standards I just wanted to mention that they are a bit different.
 
Good points Ronny....the military views, and the general populations views on homosexuality were vastly different 30-40 years ago.

And as for the "un-american" type statements I make...that only goes as far as American's viewpoints on how American's should act.

It does not have anything to do with the perceptions, thoughts, and/or fantasies about how America, the country, behaves on the world stage either politically or militarily.
 
sirmyk said:
The best example I can give of "un-American" is welfare.
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Kenny Shovel said:
??? Can you explain what you mean?
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There are millions of American citizens abusing the welfare system (which, if you are unfamiliar, is a system to help out those in need via food stamps, and monthly "free" checks in the mail to get their families by), which is supposed to be a temporary thing (no longer than a few months I think), but some renew for aid over and over and over again, and some pretend deceased children are still alive to continue collecting checks to support those deceased children, and others are on the welfare system while working a full-time job (unbeknownst to the government) and live nicely on this dual income. To me, at least, the welfare system is a joke to begin with. Those that abuse this charity, are un-American. Did I answer your question?
 
Also, don't forget insurance fraud. Those that think they should get a free ride by faking some kind of medical/physical issue. Back pain is always a tough thing to prove. Person gets dis-ability, workmans compensation, insurance to cover medical costs and pain suffered, then an undercover detective videotapes the guy working a post hole digger in his backyard while putting in an in-ground swimming pool with the settlement money he got from some bogus lawsuit.

Thats un-American.
 
sirmyk said:
There are millions of American citizens abusing the welfare system (which, if you are unfamiliar, is a system to help out those in need via food stamps, and monthly "free" checks in the mail to get their families by), which is supposed to be a temporary thing (no longer than a few months I think), but some renew for aid over and over and over again, and some pretend deceased children are still alive to continue collecting checks to support those deceased children, and others are on the welfare system while working a full-time job (unbeknownst to the government) and live nicely on this dual income. To me, at least, the welfare system is a joke to begin with. Those that abuse this charity, are un-American. Did I answer your question?
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We used to see stories about generations of welfare families. I'm glad they changed the system to make it more difficult for people to abuse it.
 
Robert said:
We used to see stories about generations of welfare families. I'm glad they changed the system to make it more difficult for people to abuse it.
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But you're only glad that those people without super-human talent can't abuse the system right?

Those with un-natural, otherworldly talent can freely abuse the system all they want...like Jimi...at least that's the vibe I'm getting from most here today...
 
sirmyk said:
There are millions of American citizens abusing the welfare system (which, if you are unfamiliar, is a system to help out those in need via food stamps, and monthly "free" checks in the mail to get their families by), which is supposed to be a temporary thing (no longer than a few months I think), but some renew for aid over and over and over again, and some pretend deceased children are still alive to continue collecting checks to support those deceased children, and others are on the welfare system while working a full-time job (unbeknownst to the government) and live nicely on this dual income. To me, at least, the welfare system is a joke to begin with. Those that abuse this charity, are un-American. Did I answer your question?
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Yup, I think you answered it.
I understand what you mean by people abusing the welfare state being bad citizens (to use the definition derived from Motokids answer). I'm not in a position to know if you're correct in saying there are millions doing this, as I don't have enough knowledge of your system.
Obviously I come from a country where the balance is more towards the welfare state model than America's more full on free market aproach. As such I'm not as instinctivly hostile to the welfare system as you seem to be, and wouldn't use terms like 'charity' or 'free cheques'; however I can still see your point on abuse of the system.
 
Motokid said:
But you're only glad that those people without super-human talent can't abuse the system right?

Those with un-natural, otherworldly talent can freely abuse the system all they want...like Jimi...at least that's the vibe I'm getting from most here today...
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I don't think that anyone should be able to use their fame as a free ride or an excuse for bad behavior. I am often appalled by the things we let our celebrities get away with and they fact that so many of them make huge bucks while public workers, such as teachers, firemen, medics and yes military make such low salaries. I think our whole view on entertainers is skewed in that since but that is a bit off track I guess, but yes I think this is a good example of an american icon being very un-american.
 
All his theft, un-American, gay military, lying, deceit and such happened before he became famous. The artical states it happened in 1962.

He was just Joe Ordinary at the time...or James Ordinary.
 
Ronny said:
I am often appalled by the things we let our celebrities get away with and they fact that so many of them make huge bucks while public workers, such as teachers, firemen, medics and yes military make such low salaries.
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You could argue that given America is governed by the principles of the free market, the difference between pulic worker pay and the huge salaries paid too entertainers is actually a very American thing.
 
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