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July 2009: Milan Kundera: The Joke
- Thread starter Libra
- Start date
saliotthomas
New Member
I started it.
Seems nice.
My French edition had an apraising prologue by Aragon.
Somehow i have the feeling we won't be much discussing Kundera.
Seems nice.
My French edition had an apraising prologue by Aragon.
Somehow i have the feeling we won't be much discussing Kundera.
Libra
Active Member
I think it's nice too.When parental security is lifted,I will be here to discuss.
I still haven't finished posting for June's BOTM.
The Joke is an interesting story.The transition into Communism and the affects on party members.
From Wiki:
"In 1968, The Joke was adapted into a film by Czech New Wave director Jaromil Jireš, but the film was almost immediately banned following the Soviet clampdown on the Prague Spring."
saliotthomas
New Member
I feel so lonely...
Where are the others who voted for this book or some guys vote for the sake of it.
Damn them to hell..
Is there some bookies who take bets on the BOTM...???!!!
I'll read it anyway because i like Kundera but if you guys feel like talking about another one.
We could fall back on plan B.
We should have a Plan B
A short one,a novela,something popular.A thriller?Fanatsy?Erotic?A graphic novel?Asterix?
You name it.
I think in summer the BOTM should go for fun discution on beach novels.
Kundera just won't do in Jully.
What's august?
Where are the others who voted for this book or some guys vote for the sake of it.
Damn them to hell..
Is there some bookies who take bets on the BOTM...???!!!
I'll read it anyway because i like Kundera but if you guys feel like talking about another one.
We could fall back on plan B.
We should have a Plan B
A short one,a novela,something popular.A thriller?Fanatsy?Erotic?A graphic novel?Asterix?
You name it.
I think in summer the BOTM should go for fun discution on beach novels.
Kundera just won't do in Jully.
What's august?
Peder
Well-Known Member
Glad I didn't vote! :flowers:
But several people have recommended Kundera to me, because of my interest in Nabokov. So this tips the scale even further in favor of my getting around to him sometime -- Incredible Lightness of Being, being the usual recommendation.
Cheers
saliotthomas
New Member
Well thanks for the flowers Peder
I'm an expert in neither of them(Nabokov 2 Kundera 4)but i really can see a link betwin them.Kundera as a strange way of constructing his novels and there styles are very different.But maybe certain novels i haven't read are a bit similar.
I don't think if you came to Kundera with Nabokov in mind you would enjoy him much.
Peder
Well-Known Member
Well, that makes me even more curious. Almost all of Nabokov's novels are different from each other, so there may be a match someplace. Worth looking anyway, and reading a new author I am unfamiliar with.
The Joke might make an interesting third novel in connection with Nabokov's Invitation to a Beheading and Kafka's The Trial, which have been mentioned together elsewhere on BAR.
Peder
Well-Known Member
Looking further -- at the editorial reviews at amazon -- piques my curiosity even more. There is at least one VN novel (Pnin) with mutiple narrators, and even a joke by the author at the character's expense, so there may be room for talking. If I get around to it before the end of the month. Or even a square "to it."
Libra
Active Member
Where are the others who voted for this book or some guys vote for the sake of it.
Damn them to hell..
Is there some bookies who take bets on the BOTM...???!!!
I'll read it anyway because i like Kundera but if you guys feel like talking about another one.
We could fall back on plan B.
We should have a Plan B
A short one,a novela,something popular.A thriller?Fanatsy?Erotic?A graphic novel?Asterix?
You name it.
I think in summer the BOTM should go for fun discution on beach novels.
Kundera just won't do in Jully.
What's august?
I was thinking of sticking a GPS on each voter.:devil:
I am reading it Thomas,and it is a good book.I have my notes down up to now and I will reply tomorrow since I didn't see this early today.
I have found no comparison actually from Nabokov ,Kafka to Kundera.
August is We Have Always Lived in the Castle by Shirley Jackson
Libra
Active Member
Ludvik's downfall began with this joke:
"Optimism is the opium of the people! A healthy atmosphere stinks of stupidity! Long live Trotsky!"
He was expelled from the Party that were supporters of the Communist regime in post-World War II Czechoslovakia ,the multiple narrators in the book give their point of view about their feelings ,difference of opinions and the Party.
"Optimism is the opium of the people! A healthy atmosphere stinks of stupidity! Long live Trotsky!"
He was expelled from the Party that were supporters of the Communist regime in post-World War II Czechoslovakia ,the multiple narrators in the book give their point of view about their feelings ,difference of opinions and the Party.
saliotthomas
New Member
A third in now.
"Optimism is the opium of the people! A healthy atmosphere stinks of stupidity! Long live Trotsky!"
A sentence he write on a postcard as a joke to his candide girlfriend while she spend her holidays in a communiste summer camp.
I see the link with the trial,as the all thing seem so absurde at first but turn out to be very serious.
Mostly it is Ludvik story,and i fnd it a bit similar to Soljenitsyne in is matter of fact description of the life condition in a camp.It is not really a camp in Ludvik case,a battalion of political refuznik,but close enough.
I like the cold humour,and the fact that what appears firt as a distraction from his goals in life,a downfall, turns out to be closer to his real personality.
Something i like with Kundera is the close and direct writing.Like a good friend telling you a story,not bullshit,good and ugly,we are supose to be clever enough to understand.
"Optimism is the opium of the people! A healthy atmosphere stinks of stupidity! Long live Trotsky!"
A sentence he write on a postcard as a joke to his candide girlfriend while she spend her holidays in a communiste summer camp.
I see the link with the trial,as the all thing seem so absurde at first but turn out to be very serious.
Mostly it is Ludvik story,and i fnd it a bit similar to Soljenitsyne in is matter of fact description of the life condition in a camp.It is not really a camp in Ludvik case,a battalion of political refuznik,but close enough.
I like the cold humour,and the fact that what appears firt as a distraction from his goals in life,a downfall, turns out to be closer to his real personality.
Something i like with Kundera is the close and direct writing.Like a good friend telling you a story,not bullshit,good and ugly,we are supose to be clever enough to understand.
Comeflyaway
Member
Aw, I didn't vote but I had intended to read this and discuss it in here. I blame all the books that I had on hold at the library finally coming in... I feel pressed to finish them before they're due!
saliotthomas
New Member
Most welcome CFA,though the book is 496 pages in small writing in my edition and will take a while to read.I started late myself and it does required some concetration(that should discourage the few that were still tempted to join). But i think we could stretch the discussion past the month limit.
Libra is hard but sometime humain.
Comeflyaway
Member
Well cool, if it's not too late then I guess I will pick this up next chance I get. I'll probably swing by the library on Friday on my way home from work to drop off some books and pick up the holds waiting for me, so I might as well grab it then and try to get to it soon
Libra
Active Member
Thomas,I felt the opposite,that they were all very serious about the Party and what they were doing,but slowly they each disintigrated.
Edit: Comeflyaway,discussions always remain open for any member to post their opinions and thoughts whenever they are ready and wish to do.A discussion never has been shut down.
saliotthomas
New Member
I don't know how far you are in the book Libra,but i mean by absurde a group of student playing judge and serious the fact that it end up in a labour camp.
It start like Kafka go on as Soljenitsyne.
It start like Kafka go on as Soljenitsyne.
Libra
Active Member
Oh ok,I finished it last night.
I had a family member(still do) who was very serious(fanatic?) about Communism back in the day,and they were not kidding around in their mentality or beliefs and the way they viewed the working class the poor etc...but just like the characters in the book,they disintigrated slowly.I found as in real life (my family member) and in the book,some hypocricy went around,like Helena.
Libra
Active Member
I loved this part when he talks about Lucie:
"What did Lucie know of the great wings of history?When could she have heard their sound?She knew nothing of history.she lived bebeath it;history held no attraction for her,it was an alien to her;she knew nothing of the major problems of our times,the problems she lived with were trivial and eternal.And suddenly I’d been released;Lucie had come to take me off to her gray paradise,and the step that until such a short time before had seemed unthinkable,the step enabling me to make my exit from history,was suddenly a cause for relief and rejoicing.Lucie held me shyly by the arm,and I let myself be led…”
"What did Lucie know of the great wings of history?When could she have heard their sound?She knew nothing of history.she lived bebeath it;history held no attraction for her,it was an alien to her;she knew nothing of the major problems of our times,the problems she lived with were trivial and eternal.And suddenly I’d been released;Lucie had come to take me off to her gray paradise,and the step that until such a short time before had seemed unthinkable,the step enabling me to make my exit from history,was suddenly a cause for relief and rejoicing.Lucie held me shyly by the arm,and I let myself be led…”
Comeflyaway
Member
Finally just got around to reading this book. Not my favorite ever, but it was a good read, though I did find myself going through it quickly so that I could start on my next book. I liked that things didn't go the way that Ludvik had planned and that he wises up a bit, takes a more mature position on his life's events.