marijuana????

[RitalinKid]

Marinol? My roommate tried it. He had only positive things to say. I wish you could just take a pill or chew it, the same goes for nicotine. Nicotine actually has some health benefits, but the damage done by the popular method of ingestion far outweights nicotine's ability to prevent alzheimers or treat ADHD. I'm a pill-aholic though. I take about 12 a day, sans water a lot of the time.

 

[bobbyburns]

my mom used to take marinol. I swiped a couple of her pills one time and it made me really happy. not like haha-I'm-laughing-out-loud happy, just like smiling all the way through. I've stopped with the weed though, because it makes me sleep too much, so. no thanks, mister weed. mkay.

 

[Kookamoor]

I think it is hypocrytical for governments to talk about legalising marijuana when they're doing their damndest to get rid of smoking. I'm not a smoker of any substance, and being in the vicinity of anyone who is smoking any substance is profoundly uncomfortable for me. Frankly, I don't think tobacco should be legal to sell. Yeah, your liberties and all that, but it affects too many people in the near vicinity. Not enough people are responsible enough not to smoke around their kids and people who can't/don't/won't protest, so no one should have the priviledge. Why not just have smoking bars, where you can go if you want to breath the stuff in?

Secondly, making marijuana legal would increase casual use. I know most people can get it if they want it, but if you don't have easy access you're less likely to try it in the first place.

Thirdly, despite the fact that marijuana has less dire consequences for your lungs, THC is detrimental to your brain. That's one organ I think we all need to keep in tact.

The legislation in Canada, as I understand it, is that if you are carrying marijuana for 'personal use' (under a certain amount) then you are not charged - this prevents people having criminal records for minor infractions. Any more and you will be charged for dealing. In terms of medicinal use, it can certainly be obtained for this purpose, but is modified in some way to remove some of the chemicals in 'natural' marijuana. As such it apparently doesn't taste/smell the same. It is also very difficult to obtain for such reasons as there are all kinds of hoops to jump through, and it is usually easier to obtain illicitly than to go through the official process.

 

[bobbyburns]

I think it's hypocritical for governments not to legalize marijuana. the fluoride they put in water is more detrimental to your brain. and unlike THC and nicotine, it's a cumulative poison, which means it never leaves your system. there's nothing healthy about it. they're even saying now that it doesn't do anything for your teeth. it's like no one realizes it, but you're basically drinking the stuff that collects on smoke stacks in fertilizer factories. they scrape it off and then send it to water treatment plants.

I've also noticed on bottled water it says, "filtered for purity, but keeps in healthy fluoride".

 

[RitalinKid]

Yeah, your liberties and all that, but it affects too many people in the near vicinity. Not enough people are responsible enough not to smoke around their kids and people who can't/don't/won't protest, so no one should have the priviledge.

Not enough people are responsible drivers (I've been a passenger with some of the worst), but we still all get to drive. You make laws and punish those people who are irresponsible to the point that they endanger others.

Why not just have smoking bars, where you can go if you want to breath the stuff in?

So, you would make it illegal to have outside the marijuana den? Then, I could drive down there, get high, and drive back home high instead of sitting in my house, listening to my hippy music, not bothering anyone.

Secondly, making marijuana legal would increase casual use.

And the problem with that is?

despite the fact that marijuana has less dire consequences for your lungs, THC is detrimental to your brain.

Alcohol destroys brain cells and is absolute hell on your liver. So, do we outlaw alcohol? No. Because when they did that here in the States, the murder rate jumped 70%.

Yes, there are health arguments galore, but the government is not anybody's mom. It shouldn't set my values or make sure I live the healthiest life possible. Otherwise, fast food would be banned. The argument boils down to civil liberties, and if everyone ignore people's right to recreational chemicals, sooner or later, the government will be after something you want too, even if it's just more money out of your paycheck.

 

[honeydevil]

think about it... why don't they make alcohol illegal.. Oh, right were there, done that... made no sense and increased drinking and organized crime... that's why we don't make alc illegal, but since weed is illegal anyway, why should they make it legal?

in my opinion it sucks, but what do i have to say...?

 

[RitalinKid]

think about it... why don't they make alcohol illegal.. Oh, right were there, done that... made no sense and increased drinking and organized crime... that's why we don't make alc illegal, but since weed is illegal anyway, why should they make it legal?

So, do we outlaw alcohol? No. Because when they did that here in the States, the murder rate jumped 70%.

No disagreement there.

You've got me thinking though. Maybe the murder rate in the US would drop if we legalized it, but would conservatives think that ending prohibition of MJ was worth it? A lot of conservatives place more emphasis on values than human life, and legalized MJ doesn't line up with the way they think things should be.

 

[Kookamoor]

You make some good points, RK, but I still think that MJ should be kept illegal for the most part. I agree with what Canada has done as far as not prosecuting people for personal use, but I don't want to see it available next to tobacco products on the shelf. As I said, the government is doing its damndest to help get people *off* cigarettes, so why allow another product of similar health risks to be sold alongside them? And it is my understanding that alcohol in moderation is something that most human beings can handle. MJ, on the other hand, has a permanent effect on the brain no matter what. While alcohol can be processed by the liver, THC is just absorbed.

Btw, I don't know much about the fluoride issue, but I do know that research has shown a marked different in tooth decay in the children born prior to fluoride and then after fluoride treatments. We've seen the same thing in my family with my parents siblings. That being said, I still don't like the idea of the water supply being chemicalised. If you have such a problem with chemicals entering your system, why are you hocking back the MJ?

 

[Motokid]

Kook, I see your point about cigarettes and pot, but the similarities between pot and alcohol are way more apparent in my mind. If you can legally sell, promote, advertise, market, and give away alcohol then I really don't see how you can say that pot should be illegal.

Alcohol is way more destructive to society (maybe because it is legal) than pot. Alcohol is addictive an alters the state of your mind. What is so different about pot that it should be illegal while 150 proof Rum is on 1000's of shelves in every state in the union, and Nascar has cars, and entire races, and series promoting beer and it's consumption?

 

[Kookamoor]

Once you legalise something it's very difficult to go backwards. If alcohol or tabocco were NOT legal, would we want to legalise it? That is more the question that should be asked.

I just don't see why we should alter the current status quo. I think that medicinal marijuana should be easier to acquire, but as for the 'recreational stuff' I don't think that should necessarily be made more readily available.

 

[Motokid]

Pot is already is readily available. Plenty of people use it recreationally on a regular basis and are upstanding and contributing members of society.

Why should responcible adults not be able to decide for themselves what is acceptable to thier lifestyle and what is not?

I don't see why I can walk into any liquor store in Delaware and buy a keg of beer, and a few cases of any hard liquor and be perfectly within my legal right, but if I get caught with one joint I risk going to jail. Which scenario is more dangerous to society in that case?

 

[Kookamoor]

I don't see why I can walk into any liquor store in Delaware and buy a keg of beer, and a few cases of any hard liquor and be perfectly within my legal right, but if I get caught with one joint I risk going to jail. Which scenario is more dangerous to society in that case?

Yes, I don't agree with the heavy penalties for having pot, but I don't think it should be available like cigarettes or booze. I do like the Canadian method of no police record for 'personal use' marijuana.

The major problem I have with *all* smoking is that it doesn't just affect the person inhaling it. While I am a strong enough person to tell them to take their pollution elsewhere, not everyone is. Even if mj were allowed only inside the home, it should be a recognisable form of child abuse to raise children in an environment where *any* smoking is affecting them.

I don't think the argument of 'well alcohol is legal' is really valid here. We're talking about having the ability to dictate the future of this drug. Ignore precendent and similar products for a moment and consider the bigger picture of what we want for the future.

 

[bobbyburns]

because you can detox THC, silly. eventually it will leave your system, and then you can get high again. but like I said, I don't do that stuff anymore.

oh, and there's nothing fun about fluoride. no one ever skipped class to eat toothpaste. my point was that, on one hand the government is forcing you to consume a deadly poison that causes cancer faster than any other chemical, and has a dulling effect on the brain, then on the other hand, they turn around and say that smoking marijuana is bad because it contains THC. right... the war on drugs is just a front to keep the population in check and weed out the "bad people".

If you have such a problem with chemicals entering your system, why are you hocking back the MJ?

 

[bobbyburns]

also, I strongly disagree with telling someone else what to do with their body. if someone wants to poke himself with needles full of heroin and OD, then donate his body to necrophiliacs, what right do I have to stop him? there's a difference between trying to help people and just trying to direct their behavior.

 

[honeydevil]

also, I strongly disagree with telling someone else what to do with their body. if someone wants to poke himself with needles full of heroin and OD, then donate his body to necrophiliacs, what right do I have to stop him? there's a difference between trying to help people and just trying to direct their behavior.

Amen, but that is what society tells us every day... and as bad as it sounds, we live after rules which aren't to bend... murder, rape... etc... without those rules which tell us what is right and wrong, some people would go crazy...

 

[Motokid]

I would not start smoking pot if it became legal. Certainly not on a regular basis like I drink a beer, or have some kind of mixed drink. I probably would take a good draw or two off a nice long bong the first day it was legal just for the sake of it , but I certainly would not become a regular smoker. Just like I don't smoke cigarettes or cigars or cloves....and just like I have not toked weed for probably over 10 years now or more....which really has nothing to do with it being legal or not, but a choice I make personally.


I don't believe the world would change if pot became a legal substance other than a few less people would get into legal trouble, which to me would be a good thing. I don't see stoners causing the worlds problems...not the ones stoned on pot anyway. The legal system could use the break and so could the recreational toker.

It's hypocracy to have pot illegal and alcohol legal. IMHO

 

[Kookamoor]

I'm getting to the 'agree to disagree' stage here. I agree with you moto, as far as people getting lighter sentences. But that doesn't have to translate to legalising the stuff, as I cited in the Canadian example (which you haven't acknowledged as a good or bad idea yet ). As long as it stays largely illicit people can smoke it in their own homes which is probably a good thing - as RK said earlier, perhaps this would discourage people from driving while under the influence.

My nightmare would be having to contend with smelling the shit in the street like I do with cigarettes. You want to hear a rant about honouring MY right to clean air and MY personal liberties not to smell your cancer-causing-tar-choking shit? It cuts both ways. IMHO the Government should never have allowed cigarette smoking to be legal. I'm sure that if a company started marketting lysol or antifreeze as a refreshing drink they'd be shut down pretty damn fast. I just don't see any reason to make the prolification of marijuana any more widespread or easy to obtain.

But you seem to want to compare it to alchol, not cigarettes. Fine. A culture has grown up with the drinking of alcohol over hundreds of years and it has become acceptable to only drink in the afternoon, and maybe a small tipple during the day. In addition to this it is illegal (oh my God, not my liberties!!) to drink in public. When you say 'legalise marijuana' what do you mean? People can get high on the street? What kind of regulatory framework would the substance have? As far as I'm concerned, until there is legislation that keeps it out of my face and prevents people from abusing it and becoming something else to be concerned about on the roads, why change the current status quo? Fix the current laws for personal use, but to say 'legalise marijuana' without a plan and without sufficient research is foolhardy and just plain stupid.

 

[bobbyburns]

ow, you're an angry kookamoor.

 

[Motokid]

What do you mean it's illegal to drink in public?

As far as I can tell, anybody, can drink anywhere they choose, as long as it's not when you're sitting behind the wheel of a vehicle or maybe on school grounds of the public grade school system.

The only exceptions I can think of are places that have signs that tell you drinking alcohol is permitted, but other than that even most churches freely encourage drinking....

 

[Kookamoor]

No, I'm not an angry Kookamoor - more a passionate and frustrated one. I'm a very liberal person, and I usually fall towards the left of most social causes. But this one frustrates me because the 'legalise marijuana' call is one that many people are crying without fully thinking about the legal and social issues, let alone the incomplete research on the full effects of the drug. I also find it frustrating that some proponents of various 'liberties' don't realise that in an attempt to honour their own, they are quashing the liberties of others. There is a halfway point at which we can all meet, but I don't think that 'legalising' it (whatever that means) is the answer right now.

Moto - not sure about where you live, but in Australia and Canada (to my knowledge) it is illegal to drink on the street and to be drunk in public. Ever wondered why the stereotype of a wino has him carrying the bottle in a paper bag?