Vladimir Nabokov: The Enchanter

[pontalba]

OK! Put my order in, but leave off the cherries.......otoh, you can have my share. I'll take extra hot fudge instead.

Peder wrote--....oh yes, there is the apartment that he and Vera lived in, early on, that he himself said he had rented to several different couples in the course of his writings. Plus he spoke of creating 'sets' that he would use in his stories. And these too might presumably have hung around to extend the lives of the imaginary realities he would create.

I don't remember that section. But think of all the complicated processes that took place..!! I have to stand back in awe of someone that can create such layering and technically perfect writing and sets.

 

[Peder]

I don't remember that section. But think of all the complicated processes that took place..!! I have to stand back in awe of someone that can create such layering and technically perfect writing and sets.

Pontalba,
There is no doubt he worked at it, and I suppose maybe it shows also that where there is a will there is a way! Add a smidge of genius and there you have it!
Peder

 

[SFG75]

That theme of shame reappears in the next pedophile, Arthur, who in the very opening pages of Enchanter speaks of shame and conscience in connection with the guilt he acknowldges;

The psychology of it is very fascinating to observe. The very first page contains some interesting items.

Arthur on himself:

For I cannot even consider the thought of causing pain or provoking unforgettable revulsion. Nonsense-I'm no ravisher. The limitations I have established for my yearning, the masks I invent for it when, in real life, I conjure up an absolutely invisible method of sating my passion, have a providential sophistry.

To me, this is somewhat akin to a drunk stating that they can stop whenever they want and that despite their predilection for what satisfies them, they have everything under control. On another level, isn't it interesting that the first sentence of this quoted statement is exactly what he caused? Did he not do that when the girl awoke under him and gave out a primordial scream that awoke the entire hotel? A self-fulfilling prophecy at a minimum no doubt.

 

[pontalba]

Oh SFG!!
I about spit my coffee out when I read this:

Did he not do that when the girl awoke under him and gave out a primordial scream that awoke the entire hotel? A self-fulfilling prophecy at a minimum no doubt.

ROTFALOLTIC!!

You certainly have a way with words!
Now that I have calmed down a bit, I don't mean that the incident itself was hilarious, but your way of putting it just.......I lost it!

It just might have given Arthur a small hint eh?
Ya think?

 

[Peder]

SFG!
You should warn an innocent person "Boffola coming!"
ROTFL primordially
That 'primordial' is a really good word!
Or as they say in today's slang : Oh shut up! (I hope you've heard that!)
VN missed his chance when he didn't use it right there for that shriek!
You are the King of the Day!
Peder

 

[Peder]

The psychology of it is very fascinating to observe. The very first page contains some interesting items.

...
To me, this is somewhat akin to a drunk stating that they can stop whenever they want and that despite their predilection for what satisfies them, they have everything under control. On another level, isn't it interesting that the first sentence of this quoted statement is exactly what he caused? Did he not do that when the girl awoke under him and gave out a primordial scream that awoke the entire hotel? A self-fulfilling prophecy at a minimum no doubt.

SFG,
Boy are your comments are well taken about a person who thinks he is in control but isn't.

In fact, you finally jog my brain into motion (now that I have had my coffee also ).

Arthur is the severe psychological case among them. I don't remember Humbert ever being self-critical, or at all doubtful about himself, until the last few pages. He took it as a rare accomplishment that he could spot nymphets, as I recall; her accusations that he raped her, washed off his back like water as he tut-tutted her; he heard her cry every night, seemingly without it affecting him; and worst, in my mind, he grabbed her by the neck to drage her off for 'service.' For all I can tell, from memory, he himself might just have thought the he was beginning to get on real well with Lo.

Erwin, predecessor to Arthur, was too flat a figure to have any character at all, except for the mention that one unfortunate experence in his youth had made him tomorous and shut him down forever.

Arthur is the self-accusing character among them whose muddled and guilty head VN shows us the inside of.

I wonder how many of the other characters that i haven't yet read will get VN's full psychological treatment. /I hear him turning now./

Peder

 

[pontalba]

Peder
Everything you say about Humbert is true.
do you feel a "however" coming on?

However there are examples of HH putting himself down in a self derogatory manner. Such as the one on p.44

But instead I am lanky, big-boned wooly-chested Humbert Humbert, with thick black eyebrows and a queer accent, and a cesspoolful of rotting monsters behind his slow boyish smile.

Then there was the time he compared himself to a (yes!) spider stalking his prey (looking for Lo in the house). That quote was from his diary, so is an example of what he was feeling at the time.So, while it doesn't truely compare with Arthur for "psycologically wierd" it certainly isn't the way a man normally thinks of himself.

 

[Peder]

Peder
Everything you say about Humbert is true.
do you feel a "however" coming on?

However there are examples of HH putting himself down in a self derogatory manner. Such as the one on p.44 Then there was the time he compared himself to a (yes!) spider stalking his prey (looking for Lo in the house). That quote was from his diary, so is an example of what he was feeling at the time.So, while it doesn't truely compare with Arthur for "psycologically wierd" it certainly isn't the way a man normally thinks of himself.

Pontalba,
All true
And do you sense a moreover coming?

Moreover there was that strange comment about her not being aware of what things were in his world, or having to teach her the things that were in his world, or something like that. You pointed it out originally so i'm sure it rings more of a bell with you!

But, though Humbert was aware that his world was not 'right,' he didn't seem at all consumeed by guilt about it, but just hummed along. /ooch what a pun /

It is Arthur who seems to me much more not able to come to terms with himself and consumed by self-guilt. Humbert just hooked up with Rita to satisfy his urges when Lo disappeared. No big deal for him. "Go with the flow,' wouldn't you think?

Peder

 

[pontalba]

Ah, yes, Rita the Riot.

 

[Peder]

Ah, yes, Rita the Riot.

Pontalba,
Well, yes, when you come right down to it! An interesting (irrelevant?) interlude to pass the time in a story while Lo is having her adventures off-screen elsewhere until she re-emerges? Or did it have some deeper significance that I missed? As a wild thought, maybe a maturation process for Humbert? So that he can be accepting of his Lo in her married and haggard condition when he finds her again? Hmh! Food for thought.

Peder

 

[pontalba]

ping....

Peder
I rather liked Rita. She certainly was different and I would say that she in a way saved HH's bacon/sanity. See p.259, Lolita

....she was the most soothing, the most comprehending companion that I ever had, and certainly saved me from the madhouse.

Together they had some adventures that I am sure would make highly amusing reading, just wish Nabokov had elaborated on that either then or later....oh well.
Rita seemed to me to be one of those unfortunate beings that really have good hearts, but are constantly being taken advantage of by nasties, and misunderstood by so called 'do-gooders'. Like her dear creepy brother.

 

[Peder]

ping....

Peder
I rather liked Rita. She certainly was different and I would say that she in a way saved HH's bacon/sanity. See p.259, Lolita
Together they had some adventures that I am sure would make highly amusing reading, just wish Nabokov had elaborated on that either then or later....oh well.
Rita seemed to me to be one of those unfortunate beings that really have good hearts, but are constantly being taken advantage of by nasties, and misunderstood by so called 'do-gooders'. Like her dear creepy brother.

Pontalba,
I have just been rereading the Rita episode (also?) and it is briefer than I remember it. And it is also noticebale for VN having broken out in a complete rash of alliteration all over his body and on paper also. Yoicks the written style! I suppose to complement the comic aspects of the story he is telling there.
But yes absolutely! Rita seems like a genuine good soul inside an imperfect personality.

She was kind, such a good sport, that I daresay she would have given herself to any pathetic creature or fallacy, an old broken tree or a bereaved procupine, out of sheer chumminess and compassion.

An yes I agree with you. I think she was a humanizing influence on Humbert and saved his sanity surely. /oh, no!/
She was for example a person whom he was able to see accurately outside of his solipsism! That would be a breakthrough for him!

In fact, I now see that, just before the episode he says (p 258)

Solitude was corrupting me. I needed company and care. My heart was a hysterical and unreliable organ. This is how Rita enters the picture.

and your quote from p259, which you didn't give, was no doubt,

... she was the most soothing, the most comprehending companion that I ever had, and certainly saved me from the madhouse.

That's pretty high praise from Humbert!
Peder

 

[Peder]

SFG!
You should warn an innocent person "Boffola coming!"
ROTFL primordially
That 'primordial' is a really good word!
Or as they say in today's slang : Oh shut up! (I hope you've heard that!)
VN missed his chance when he didn't use it right there for that shriek!
You are the King of the Day!
Peder

SFG et al,
Just so there is no possible misunderstanding of that slang phrase, and to avoid the possibility that anyone takes it with its literal meaning, I confirmed the following meanings with my pet on-line slang dictionary:

"Shut up!"
Expression of incredulity.
Similar to "No way!" or
"Wow, I can't believe it!"

I might also add, similar to

"Get outta here!"
Exclamation upon hearing of an event with minimum probability.
Similar to "No way!"

So I was expressing my admiration, not anything else. (In New Yorkese, of course).


Peder

 

[pontalba]

You mean Noo Yawkese right!?


As far as Humbert, I think that would have been his last trip to the madhouse, and maybe Quilty would have been still alive running around after "nymphets" still...........

Arthur was a far different stripe from Humbert though. Not so chronically melencoly or guilt ridden. Or maybe VN had simply perfected "guilt ridden" by that time, and had more completely worked out the character. And Arthur's nervousness was certainly not well concealed as Humberts either.

 

[SFG75]

Oh SFG!!
I about spit my coffee out when I read this:

ROTFALOLTIC!!

You certainly have a way with words!
Now that I have calmed down a bit, I don't mean that the incident itself was hilarious, but your way of putting it just.......I lost it!

It just might have given Arthur a small hint eh?
Ya think?

LOL-just now went back and read this post after Peder mentioned it in a later one. The emphasis on the scream really made it intense for me. I guess that when you read that Arthur really didn't hear the girl because he was in his own little perv universe, I imagined a horrofic scream. Something that undoubtedly would've been belted out by a poor soul in the given situation.

 

[Peder]

Pontalba

You mean Noo Yawkese right!?

LOL. Right on! You know my native language better than I do!

As far as Humbert, I think that would have been his last trip to the madhouse, and maybe Quilty would have been still alive running around after "nymphets" still...........

Last trip, probably. Especially since she wan't driving him crazy.
And he wouldn't have become a murderer, which certainly has to counted as good. Certainly for him, but also in the larger sense. Quilty should be taken care of by the authorities, not Humbert. And until he is, well, he runs around with perverts and nymphets.

Arthur was a far different stripe from Humbert though. Not so chronically melencoly or guilt ridden. Or maybe VN had simply perfected "guilt ridden" by that time, and had more completely worked out the character. And Arthur's nervousness was certainly not well concealed as Humberts either.

I assume you mean it was Humbert not so melancholy or guilt ridden. Arthur was a very tightly wrapped guy compared to Humbert's ability to take many things in stride. Although both did fear the police, justifiably. But I was especially struck by Arthur's parting thoughts "to get rid of the no-longer-needed already-looked-at idiotic world."
That's a very severe judgement, after 25 years of holdiing himself in, finally to conclude that he had seen what the world had to offer and that he would never get from it what he wanted. Humbert never felt that way about things as far as I can tell. (Or if he did he checked into a hospital) So it is little wonder that Arthur wanted out, while Humbert survived.
VN's characters definitely improved, and became better adjusted, the more he psycho-analyzed them. tee-hee.

Peder

 

[pontalba]

Actually, no. I meant that Humbert was the more melancholy and guilt ridden or the two. At least it was expressed as that to my eyes.

Tightly wrapped is an excellent way of describing Arthur though. And when HE came undone......WoW! and or Pow! heh, heh....

 

[StillILearn]

That's two posts lost to cyberspace in one sitting. I think I'll go eat me a pound or two of chocolate.

 

[pontalba]

That's two posts lost to cyberspace in one sitting. I think I'll go eat me a pound or two of chocolate.

Cooommmmeee baaaccckkkkk Shaannneee.........um, I mean StilllllliiiiiLLLLLeeearrrrrn..........

I have two words...Copy....Paste
Now whenever I have a longish post....copy and paste. Had lost one....aaarrrggghhhhh.............phooey even.

 

[SFG75]

Cooommmmeee baaaccckkkkk Shaannneee.........um, I mean StilllllliiiiiLLLLLeeearrrrrn..........

I have two words...Copy....Paste
Now whenever I have a longish post....copy and paste. Had lost one....aaarrrggghhhhh.............phooey even.

Oh come on, fifteen seconds is enough time to create a well-thought out post. What do you think this is....a book forum where people post more than one or two sentences at a time?